[Reader-list] Can I borrow your term 'Reflected Appraisal'?

[mahmood farooqui]

This was a wonderful post on Junior Artistes, Vasundhra. Your
exhaustive list of respondents was equally impressive. With all our
interest in films we actually know so little of the actual conditions
of film production and your post goes some distance in offsetting some
aspects.

What I want to know is this-is there a differentiation between models,
dancing boys and girls and junior artistes. I understand that if you
are not a member of the Junior Artiste Association you cannot appear
in the film, is that true? And if you are a member of the Association,
are you still dependent on the Artist suppliers to get work?

And, once the association grades you, can the production side still
override their ranking, make an A grade person lower or vice versa?

Looking forward to more on extras...

On 22/05/06, Vasundhara Prakash <vasundhara.prakash at gmail.com> wrote:
> Reflected Appraisal is the perception of how others perceive us and
> evaluate us. This theory suggests that we see ourselves as others see
> us, or as we think they do. It is perceived reactions. The operative
> word here is "perceived"   because research has demonstrated that a
> person's interpretation of others' opinion is conditioned by self
> analysis and may not necessarily be accurate. The research also
> suggests that the extent, to which this perception of external
> appraisal shapes our judgment of ourselves, depends on the importance
> to us of the people providing it. Particularly influential are the
> reactions of "significant others," people whose opinions make a
> difference to us.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> January 23rd, St. Carmel School, Bandra, Mumbai. This was the first
> time I was going to meet junior artistes shooting for the film,
> 'Marathon'. The first person I met was Kitty, an English-speaking,
> well-dressed, Catholic girl in her early 20s. After having struggled
> to explain what a fellowship meant, in the course of proving that I
> wasn't a journalist, Kitty told me how they all hated journalists.
> "Many of the people have families in villages, but we live with our
> families here who read the kind of stories that journalists write
> about us, that spoils our reputations."
>
> They fear being misrepresented. XYZ told me about an article that had
> been written about dance bar girls which featured photographs of
> junior artistes. They felt cheated, betrayed and completely
> misrepresented.
>
> >From day one when a person comes to either the Junior Artistes'
> Association/Mahila Kalakar Sangh office s/he is judged on the basis of
> looks and age ie; their exterior selves and classified into grades.
>
> The Junior Artistes Association (men's wing) has the following grades:
>
> Grade A: This class comprising of both young and old are required
> usually for hotel scenes, airport scenes.
> Grade B:  men are used for playing villagers, constables etc.
>
> The Mahila Kalakar Sangh (women's wing) has the following grades:
>
> Super Class: Class members are required for parties, wedding scenes,
> airports etc,
> Grade A: members for a regular crowd in hospitals, market places etc,
> Grade B: members are those who can pass off as villagers, beggars etc.
>
> Members are to be classified at least every five years if not
> annually. All the members are called in the office one by one and two
> producers, two Federation officer-bearers; two cine agents/suppliers
> classify them into different grades.
>
> When one does become a member a lot depends on your
> relationship/rapport with the Junior Artiste supplier/Cine Agent. If
> you're in his (almost always) good books, you are bound to get more
> work. Therefore a supplier's opinion about you gets you all the work.
>
> So in a junior artistes' life others' opinions, judgments,
> classification, appearance, grading, reputation are crucial.
>
> While a group of psychology students engage in finding answers to
> "Where do judgments come from? Are they based on human instincts or
> are they influenced by outside variables? If they are influenced, what
> is most likely to have an impact on judgments and what had the
> strongest impact? What are the patterns of judgment of others based on
> their own gender and other personal traits? Do people think they have
> the right to judge others more in one field if they believe themselves
> to be superior in that field?"  I will share with you what the
> "significant others" really think about junior artistes. The following
> is based on meetings, interviews, chats, arguments and counter
> arguments with various people from the Hindi film industry on their
> experiences, treatments, grouses, perceptions and opinions of Junior
> Artistes.
>
>
>
> "The irony of being recognized"
> Anurag Kashyap is one of those directors who casts junior artistes in
> major roles. Junior artiste and Assistant Supplier, Deva was cast as a
> police official in Black Friday. Anurag refuses to work with the top
> classes of the Association members because eventually it is the same
> people who are sent for work. And a recognizable junior artiste makes
> a film look unreal and unauthentic. There are many who get stuck in
> this sort of a phase when they are relatively recognized but precisely
> because of their recognition nobody wants to give them work.
> Anurag feels a huge difference in the way junior artistes are treated
> in India and in the treatment abroad. "Gai bhains ki tarah haankte
> hain" He adds that it is more difficult for women because they are
> assumed to be prostitutes. One often hears of such incidents
> concerning female junior artistes and production people, even big time
> stars at times. He adds that a lot of female junior artistes even get
> opt for C-grade films.
> Anurag narrating his own experience of working as an extra in ad films
> and a feature called Chirantan for pocket money says that there are
> many people who eventually become members of the Association because
> it is difficult to go back to your homes with the humiliation of not
> being able to make it.
> Anurag Kashyap
> Writer: Love Story 2050 (2006) (announced) (dialogue), Fool and Final
> (2006) (pre-production) (dialogue), Guru (2006) (filming) (dialogue),
> Water (2005) (Hindi dialogue and script consultant), Main Aisa Hi Hoon
> (2005) (dialogue), Yuva (2004) (dialogue), Black Friday (2004)
> (screenplay), Paisa Vasool (2004), Paanch(2003), Nayak: The Real
> Hero(2001) (dialogue), Jung (2000), Shool (1999) (dialogue), Kaun
> (1999), Satya (1998), Kabhie Kabhie (1997) (TV series)
> Director: Gulal (under-production) Black Friday (2004), Paanch (2003)
> Actor: The Maharaja's Daughter (1994) (mini TV series) as Lt. Sayed, Chirantan()
>
>
>
>  "Lower Depths"
> Debu calls the junior artistes the underbelly of the Hindi film
> industry, drawing a parallel to Maxim Gorky's Lower Depths. Because of
> their backgrounds, many being slum-dwellers, junior artistes are
> looked down upon. He says that it's not about the profession that much
> as is it about the class they come from- exploitation of this class is
> rampant, anywhere and everywhere. One hears of female junior artistes
> being taken advantage of, especially on outdoor shoots, some women are
> specially brought for this. When I ask him if it is forced, he says
> money is an indirect force.
> Other people on the sets have notions about junior artistes that they
> dirty the toilets, make a mess of everything. Debu believes that an
> orientation of junior artistes as well as about them is extremely
> necessary for promoting professionalism in the industry.
> Bombay film industry is all about the money, there is no dignity of
> either art or the artistes. "Jo sabse zyada paisa leta hai, woh Boss
> hai, Junior Artiste sabse kam paisa leta hai, to woh naukar hai".
> There are many directors who don't even bother to find out the actor's
> name. And Debu should know since he has himself risen from the ranks.
> "Yahan Art nahi hai, yahan pet hai"
> Debuyandu Bhattacharya
> NSD Graduate, Actor: The Rising (2005) as Krupashankar Singh, Black
> Friday(2004) as Yeda Yakub, Ab Tak Chhappan(2004) as Zameer's Gang
> member, Aetbaar(2004), Maqbool(2003) as Chinna's killer, Monsoon
> Wedding(2001), Divya Drishti(2001) as Hawaldaar
>
>
>
> "I felt humilated…."
> Richa was auditioned and signed for the original Munnabhai MBBS, when
> Shah Rukh Khan was supposed to play the main lead and the setting was
> supposed to be of a chawl (dhobi ghaat later). Ultimately her role was
> reduced to that of a Junior Artiste. She started being treated like
> one on the sets. She confessed to have felt extremely humiliated. Soon
> she walked out of the film.
> Richa also told me that to know more about their lives it would be
> interesting to talk her TV actor friend's driver, because the junior
> artiste interact mostly with drivers.
> In the Indo-french film Hawa Aane De, Richa plays a bar dancer. She
> wonders why on one hand she was very proud to get the opportunity to
> portray a different kind of role, the junior artiste in the background
> would hide their faces.
> Richa Bhattacharya
> NSD Graduate, Actor: TV serials,The Rising(2005), Hava Aane De(2004),
> Dhoop(2003)
>
>
>
> "Gender Stereotypes and expectations"
> There is a stereotype about the women junior artistes. They are
> expected to "compromise". Since everything eventually comes down your
> rapport with the hand that feeds you, in the case of a supplier, he
> always tries to please the production by offering women to the
> assistant directors and production managers.
> Apu recalls instances on the sets when women were thrown at him, so
> that the supplier could get a better cut or the Mahila Kalakar herself
> would be able to stand in the centre, near the main leads.
> Apartiem Khare
> Associate Director, Hum Dil De Chuke Sanam(1999), Devdas(2001/2), Black(2005)
>
>
>
> "The problem is with us"
> Devang says that we can't blame the junior artistes who are anyway
> extremely underpaid and ill-treated, for not being involved and
> responsible on the sets. Instead he takes the blame saying that there
> is a need for better planning and organization at the higher level. He
> suggests that the supplier should be involved in the pre-production
> stage and then it should be the responsibility of the supplier to make
> sure that the environment/ambience is created appropriately by the
> junior artistes as per the requirement. He proposes an orientation of
> the junior artistes about their work.
> Devang Desai
> Assistant Director: Bhoot(2003), White Noise(2005), Kaal(2005),
> Salaam-e-Ishq(under production)
>
>
>
> "Many experienced veterans"
> Talking from experience Rakesh thinks that if one treats junior
> artistes as humans, they are fine. Unfortunately they are not usually
> treated as human beings. On the sets mostly their identity is from the
> colour of their clothes, "Oye! Red shirt!", "Green pant, tum idhar se
> idhar passing dega!"
> Rakesh also narrates incidents when some of the veteran junior
> artistes have displayed a far more informed technical knowledge of
> camera angles, lenses and frames than the technicians themselves.
> Rakesh Sain,
> Assitant Director,
>
>
>
> "Tragic Comedy"
> Most junior artistes come to the industry to become stars but
> unfortunately nobody tells them that they can't, ultimately it's a
> gradual acceptance. According to Vikramaditya junior artistes are an
> extremely important part of the film but sadly they don't get the
> respect in return. They are treated badly, yelled at, many a times not
> provided with basic facilities such as toilets.
> The junior artiste group is an extremely close-knit group, actually
> the only group that doesn't interact with anybody else on the sets.
> Vikramaditya points out that the older women especially can be quite
> grumpy and uninvolved in their work probably because they are the most
> affected by trend of non members being roped in for their work.
> When asked if he thought women were treated any differently he said
> "they're all one". Though what interests him about junior artistes is
> the relationship they have with the suppliers; suggesting obvious
> sexual undercurrents.
> Vikramaditya's favourite junior artiste moment was when he shot the
> rock song in Paanch. The song was shot in very long takes and
> therefore the crowd (junior artistes) got quite involved and started
> reacting to the performance (by actor KayKay) and the song like they
> were actually in a rock concert. "It looked right, it felt right". He
> thinks the more involved they are, the better they work.
> He considers junior artistes to be both insiders in terms of their
> importance and outsiders in terms of their treatment and involvement.
> As we step out of the coffee shop, Vikramaditya says he always wonders
> why 'extras' is a derogatory term just for Indians who are doing
> "extra" work while everywhere else in the world it is an accepted
> term?
> Vikramaditya Motwane
> Executive Assistant: Deepa Mehta, Water (2005), Director, songs and
> Sound Designer: Paanch (2003), Associate Director and Sound Designer:
> Devdas (2002/I)
>
>
>
> "I don't find anything to romanticize about"
> Prawaal thinks that there is nothing to romanticize about junior
> artistes, they are well-paid and well-treated. Everybody is here to do
> their job; a film set is not a family, it's not supposed to be. "You
> do your work, you get paid, and you go home." According to Prawaal
> junior artistes are not supposed to be creatively involved in the
> film, they are merely moving props but are just as much a part of the
> film as anybody else is.
> A director/writer/actor is committed to or belongs to a film at least
> till the film is released but a junior artiste has no-sense of
> belonging to any film that is because they work in different films
> every shift, it would be ridiculous to expect them to be involved.
> Prawaal Raman
> Director, Zabardast (underproduction), Darna Zaroori Hai(2006), Loot
> (Stuck/On Hold)
> Gayab, Darna Mana Hai (also the story writer)
>
>
>
> "Baithe Hain Rahguzar Pe Hum, Koi Hume Uthaye Kyon?"
> It is probably because of the fact that Imtiaz is so fond of junior
> artistes that he had so much to say about them. As a director, he
> compares junior artistes to props, they are numbers that one uses to
> dress a frame. Their treatment as mere objects that can be quantified
> causes further angst to their misery of shattered dreams. He says one
> has to be careful when it comes to junior artistes, you have to
> understand why they are the most seemingly desentisized people in the
> industry. The primary cause of their bitterness is probably because
> almost all junior artistes have higher aspirations which with time get
> crushed. The journey to become a hero and the feeling of self gets
> trampled along the way. Imtiaz believes that they are always wearing
> their armours, ready for combat, almost fortifying themselves against
> any possibility of being hurt. You can't expect them to
> enthusiastically participate in your collective dream of the film
> because for them their biggest dreams have already been shattered.
> They put their guards down only when you make them trust you that you
> acknowledge the fact that they human beings too. Little things like
> who gets a chair, how many times does one can get chai and who can
> talk to the director are the kind of things junior artistes are
> sensitive about. He points out that interestingly the different grades
> determine their treatment and the demands they can make. Imtiaz argues
> that one can understand that the main actors are important but that
> doesn't give anybody the authority to defile anybody's sensitivity.
> Though it is difficult to be friends with junior artistes especially
> girls because they always think one expects something in return.
> As far as the girls are concerned, he hasn't had any direct experience
> but he has reasons to believe that there are many "informal
> prostitutes". He explains that he understands why a woman junior
> artiste would be attracted to prostitution that is because she shares
> the misfortune that a film heroine has. Her film career span is very
> short and at the time when she is at the prime of her look, she tries
> to make the most of it. They have to be content with the fact that as
> the years go by the money be less. One often hears of women junior
> artistes being full-fledged prostitutes and 'kepts'.
> Then Imtiaz fondly remembers Saira, a junior artiste who turned out be
> a talented actress. After having given her a character in the TV
> serial, Imtihaan, he would encourage her to take the leap and try to
> become an actress. Since a board consists of only numbers of the
> requirement, you cannot ask for a specific junior artiste. "When I
> would insist on her the word got around that I wanted to sleep with
> her." When Imtiaz met her after a few years, he realized that Saira
> was already on her journey down.
> Imtiaz realizes that there is a certain comfort in not having to go
> from one director to another with your photographs and resume to be an
> actor but being a junior artiste. He says that it is almost like
> prostitutes where there are no pretensions; their worth is on their
> faces (different grades). "Main 600 wali hoon!" "Main 400 wala hoon!"
> "Jo hain yehi hai"  He quotes Ghalib saying, "I am already at the
> lowest point, who is going to put me down further"
> Imtiaz Ali
> Director and Editor, Television for 7yrs, Socha Na Tha (2005)
> Actor, Black Friday as Yakub Menon
>
>
>
> "The obsession with the stars: a vicious circle"
> Earlier there used to be three kinds of junior artistes:
> 1.In the crowd, 2. near the Hero/Heroine 3. saying dialogues. Now one
> usually finds crowd scenes being given to Association members while
> the better looking models are placed near the main leads and the
> talking roles are given to either struggling actors. One also finds a
> trend of special appearances by stars becoming a favourite.
> It is an extremely sad story that film journalism is completely
> centred around the stars because that is what the masses are
> interested in while the other aspects of cinema are of academic
> interest only. Popular writing comprises of rumours, gossip and trivia
> about the stars.
> ~Legendary gossip columnist Liz Smith of the New York Post, author of
> Dishing, argues that gossip builds fame and legends: "I always say to
> people when they object to the things that are written about them,
> 'Accept it as part of your myth.'"~
> According to Ajayji every junior artiste comes to Bombay to become a
> star. Though many people from Bombay who become members are
> slum-dwellers and for them this is a job opportunity that pays like
> any other B-grade C-grade job. There is no aspiration or a higher goal
> for stardom.
> Ajay Brahmatmaj
> Film journalist, Dainik Jagran
>
>
>
>
> "Models do exist"
> Navdeep after having admitted that he knew very little about junior
> artistes agrees that especially in ad films because of their glossy
> and glamorous look they usually require better looking junior artistes
> (Super Class and Grade A) and models. It is not a social judgment but
> just a requirement.
> Navdeep
> AD filmmaker, Red Ice
>
>
>
> "The Model Game"
> Jordyn dedicates a chapter on models in his book, Backside Bollywood.
> "This chapter details an informal system of how in-front-of-the-camera
> talent operates, displaying the internal dynamics of a huge chunk of
> the film world which receives scant attention." He rejects the popular
> belief that almost all junior artistes come to become stars, his
> observation is that serious and able aspirants choose the model route
> instead. Going through model coordinators models get better work,
> better treatment, better exposure and also better money.
> Jordyn Steig
> Author, Backside of Bollywood: Hindi Films Up Close and Personal In
> Mumbai (unpublished)
> Actor, Mitti(2001), Page 3(2005)
>
>
>
> "Most helpful…."
> Shubhankar narrates various incidents when the junior artistes have
> stood out to be the most helpful and giving people in the industry.
> During a Sanjay Leela Bhansali film shoot, the producer Bharat Shah
> had been jailed, Bhansali informed everybody that he would not be able
> to pay everybody right away. Inspite of the fact that junior artistes
> are paid daily, they were the first ones to come forward to cooperate
> with Bhansali, and worked for months without money.
> According to Shubhankar they're an extremely close-knit community and
> he thinks them to be complete insiders of the industry.
> Shubhankar
> Assitant Director, Hum Dil De Chuke Sanam(1999), Haasil(2003), Devdas(2001/2)
>
>
>
> "Parallel narrative"
> In Nikhil's 8-year experience as an assistant, while the director
> concentrated on the foreground with the main leads, he enjoyed
> constructing his own stories in the background. He believes that the
> foreground and the background should blend smoothly without either of
> them sticking out as a sore thumb. He doesn't believe in unimaginative
> passings from one side of the frame to the other like zombies. He says
> he always encourages his assistants to develop corresponding stories
> in the background. A good example of this is the scene from Kuch Kuch
> Hota Hai, where the actress Neelam, playing a TV host, asks the crowd
> for love messages to be aired live on television. This is right before
> Kajol's character Anjali finds out that the little girl, Anjali in the
> summer camp is her college friend's (Shah Rukh Khan's character)
> daughter. Interestingly, it is Nikhil Advani(assistant in KKHH) who
> comes out of the crowd and gives a nasty message to his wife saying
> he's dumping her because he has found somebody else.
> Another thing that he encourages his assistants to do is to find out
> the names of the junior artistes. In long schedules he would always
> make it a point to either find out their names or give them names
> lovingly. He realized that by doing so the junior artistes felt as if
> they were part of the film not just notionally but substantially.
> Unfortunately junior artistes are usually treated like cattle in this
> industry. Comparing them to extras abroad, Nikhil jokingly says that
> if they were to be treated the way the junior artistes are treated
> here, they would shut us down immediately. He says that the disparity
> is ofcourse because of the difference between a developed country and
> a developing country. He adds that though there is no excuse for it,
> most of the production is treated like that.
> Finally Nikhil shares his major grouse against the Junior Artiste
> Association. He argues that for a cinematographer to get work, s/he
> needs a degree from a recognized institute say the Film and Television
> Institute of India (FTII), work under an established director of
> photography, who writes a recommendation and it is only then that s/he
> can become a member of their Association. The same goes for dancers,
> make-up artists, set designers etc. "So how is it that a junior
> artiste is not expected to act? How is that everybody behind the
> camera is supposed to have a certain skill but the people who are
> going to be seen on camera require no qualifications?" Besides,
> becoming a member of the junior artiste Association is a mere
> fulfillment of the Bombay dream of becoming a star. Therefore there
> are 800 members out of which only a small percentage know how to act.
> He agrees with his assistant, Devang's suggestion that there should be
> an orientation for the junior artistes that would equip them to
> understand the basics of the work better.
> Nikhil Advani
> Director, Kal Ho Na Ho, Salaam-e-Ishq(under-production)
> Assistant Director, Kuch Kuch Hota Hai(1998), Mohabbatein(2000) Kabhi
> Khushi Kabhi Gham(2001)
>
>
>
> "Those who get desperate, join the Junior Artistes Association"
> Interestingly, Asha K. Chandra aspired to become a star herself but
> now she runs an acting school that trains aspirants in film acting,
> dance and fighting.  Ashaji tells me that there are people who after
> having struggled for sometime give up and become members of the Junior
> Artistes Association as a way to sustain themselves.
> Asha Chandra
> FTII Graduate, runs a film acting school in Juhu, features in Lalit
> Vachani's Star Maker
>
>
>
> "Bas Ek Parivar Jaise Hain"
> Deva insists that nobody becomes a junior artiste in order get a break
> into acting. Earlier only Muslim girls used to join this line but
> gradually people realized that it is a decent way to earn a living,
> now there girls and boys from all kinds of backgrounds and families
> that come.
> According to Deva, the struggling actors and even the assistant
> directors should become members and work for atleast six months, he
> believes the kind of exposure and access one get to the industry and
> the people would be useful for them. For him, it is a perfect platform
> for learning and experience.
> Coming back to the question of how many junior artistes think this
> line to be an entry into the industry, he insists that our junior
> artistes have no such ambitions. Many times junior artistes don't want
> to be in the centre, be seen or given lines that is because once a
> junior artiste is seen in a scene, s/he will not get more work in that
> production. How things work here is that a particular supplier has his
> set of junior artistes that he sends to X,Y,Z production. If a film is
> being shot with junior artistes for 100 days, a junior artiste
> normally is used for various scenes say, railway station, market
> place, airport etc, so consistent work for 100 days is assured. But
> once a junior artiste gets a line say as a ticket collector, he is
> seen and therefore cannot be used again.
> When I tell Deva that one thing that everybody says about junior
> artistes is that they have an extremely strong Association, he
> immediately corrects me saying that is us who are strong and always
> looking out for each other, the Association does its work in pulling
> out non-members from film sets.
> Deva
> Junior Artiste and Assistant Supplier, Guddu Suri, Suri & Co.
> Actor, Police official in Black Friday
>
>
>
> "Better facilities"
> It was in the office of the Federation of Western Indian Cine
> Employees that I met Ms. Nones. She had been called by Mr. Ranjan, the
> Secretary of the Federation to meet me. Thinking that I am a
> journalist (as usual!) they'd already prepared a list of problems that
> needed media attention.  Unfortunately only 10% of the members and
> that too of only the Super Class get consistent work, others get only
> 5-10 days work in a month. Another trouble they face is lack of basic
> facilities like toilets and changing rooms.  Having said that, Delphin
> says that there are both people who are suffering because of lack of
> work as well as people who are quite well-off. The media tends to
> always focus on their plight, completely ignoring people who are
> earning a decent living out of this profession.  She gives me a list
> of old people who did substantial work as junior artistes in their
> time and supported their families.
> Delphin Nones
> Vice-President, Mahila Kalakar Sangh
>
>
>
> "Roz Kuan Khodna, Roz Paani Peena"
> Aziz Khan says it is not an easy life. What usually happens is that
> the higher grades are connected with the suppliers on a daily basis
> through mobile phones, but the rest of the grade members have to go to
> the Association office everyday and wait for that one phone call from
> the production that will get them work that day. Therefore, it's an
> everyday struggle.
> Aziz Khan
> Ex- Junior Artiste Association council member
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