[Reader-list] Rape Victim ordered 200 lashes and prison by Saudi judges

[Pawan Durani]

Dear Partha ,

Though I wished to discuss on many points you have expressed , but for a
moment I just wanted to ask you a simple question

As regards to people like Yasin malik and Bitta karate .....what is your
idea of peaceful solution ?

Pawan


On 12/1/07, Partha Dasgupta <parthaekka at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Pawan,
>
> I think we strayed a bit from what Shuddha mentioned, that is that he's as
> against the overtness of the Saudi regime as he is against the Modi one.
> What I have been referring to is the opposition of state-sponsored /
> encouraged violence that has occured in Gujarat, Nandigram and now the POSCO
> incidents. The moment any government needs to take action through non-legal
> punitive action, it steps out of the system of checks and balances that the
> constitution places upon us which is criminal - all the more so since it's
> being done by the very people who are chosen by us to uphold the
> constitution.
>
> On the issue of Babri Masjid / the Ram temple would like to figure out the
> logic of 'going back to the basics'. If today we start pulling down every
> building place that was once something else and replacing it with whatever
> it was, we'd have to knock down the Konarak Temple and even the North Block
> and virtually every building. Extremely ridiculous, wouldn't you agree?
>
> In any case, I never subscribed to the thought that God resides in a
> building. Turning a structure from a mosque to a temple can not take or add
> God to that structure.
>
> I will not talk of 'secular' parties as all parties by the very nature of
> their existence are bound to their vote banks. On the other hand, I
> certainly stay far from the BJP that is tied by it's core to the RSS and
> Hindu ideology - which I believe is incorrect for a party with national
> dreams. And I saw the rath yatra in Delhi with the jingoistic slogans, and I
> saw the BJP leaders in their double-speak when the court took up the Babri
> Masjid case. Typical politicians with forked tongues that mean nothing
> except public appeasement and dodging responsibility. However, the BJP
> fanaticism makes me distrust them.
>
> As for Kashmir, there is no one view, and each concerned party has
> different wants. Sure, I hear the shouts and I hear of the deaths and the
> pain. I hear the anger of people, each with their own bias and perspective.
> Do I know the 'ground reality'?
>
> No. Even if I went there I wouldn't as each 'group' in that conflict has
> become fragmented with different demands (that have changed over time,
> different 'truths' and different hates.
>
> Am not an expert on sociology, and certainly not on Kashmir, but I do like
> the idea of the killing stopping, a space to breathe and talk, and to
> resolve the issues one at a time through dialogue and not guns. Killing
> Yasin Malik, Bitta Karate is just another step onwards in the path of death.
>
>
> Sure, it's easy for me to talk as I've not been dispossesed by that
> conflict.
>
> What I'm trying to ask is what do you really want? A peaceful resolution
> or retribution?
>
> Rgds, Partha
> ....................
>
>
>  On 12/1/07, Pawan Durani <pawan.durani at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Shuddha Wrote : " One does not have to link the decadence of current
> > Saudi
> > Arabia to the
> > venality of Moditva/Hindutva. They are two different kinds of
> > abominations
> > that need to be fought, and fought till they are destroyed. I would be
> > just
> > as happy to see Salafist Islamo-fascism perish in Saudi Arabia, as I
> > would
> > be to see the short, sharp end of Moditva and Hindutva in Gujarat and in
> >
> > India.
> >
> > Dear Shuddha ,
> >
> > While as you have an obsession with Modi and looking at how few of you
> > try
> > to link everything and anything communal happening with Modi , I wonder
> > where does your conscience lead to ?
> >
> > Each time you quote " Indian States Military Occupation In Kashmir " ,
> > without knowing the ground reality talk of your ignorance of the ground
> > reality . You would be ready to accept figures given by a terrorist or a
> >
> > separatist organisation and at the same time averse to the real figures.
> >
> > Each time you tend to ignore the genocide of hindus which happened over
> > a
> > period of time , but you feel merry to spread discontent among minorties
> > by
> > harping on a one time incident of Gujarat.
> >
> > Each time you talk about structure of Ram Temple being destroyed [ which
> > some of you called Babri ] , and at the same time non of you have ever
> > discussed hundreds of temples being broken down to peices in Kashmir .
> >
> > Each time you talk about liberty of expression and at the same time you
> > want
> > all these liberties to be taken with Hindu relegion.
> >
> > Each time you talk of secular parties which you love even though thay
> > may be
> > aligned with a ML type of organisation and at the same time you need an
> > anti
> > allergic tablet if BJP is called secularist as well.
> >
> > Each time you speak of evil in Babu bajrangi but you have closed your
> > thoughts for Yasin Maliks , Bitta karate and Hamdanis.
> >
> > Cmon ...get over Modi fixation . get over your thought that Indian state
> > has
> > "occupied" Kashmir. Get over that Military is anti people in Kashmir .
> >
> > Get real.....life is much more real than typing few words on the
> > keyboard.
> >
> > Pawan Durani
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 11/30/07, shuddha at sarai.net <shuddha at sarai.net> wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear Pawan,
> > >
> > > Hell comes in different flavours, as I tried to explain in an earlier
> > > post,
> > > and as is evident from your posting of the brutal treatment meted out
> > to a
> > >
> > > young woman who has been the victim of gang rape in Saudi Arabia.
> > >
> > > Being against one kind of hell does not mean that we have to be the
> > > partisans of other kinds of hell, elsewhere. The kind of intellectual
> > that
> > >
> > > I find interesting it the one who has no problem at all in terms of
> > > evolving an engaged critique of oppression, no matter what form it
> > takes,
> > > no matter where it occurs. That is why, despite our respect for people
> > > like
> > > Noam Chomsky, some of us took it upon ourselves to sharply criticize
> > his
> > > prevaricating apology for the 'Left Front' government's violence
> > against
> > > its own subjects in West Bengal
> > >
> > > And so, contrary to your expectations, some of those of us who have
> > been
> > > active on this list in arguing against the Indian state's military
> > > occupation of the Kashmir valley have had no problems at all in being
> > > determined in our opposition to oppression when it occurs in Left
> > Front
> > > ruled West Bengal, in the current conditions of military dictatorship
> > in
> > > Burma and Pakistan, or for that matter when it occurs under the aegis
> > of
> > > the Ibn Saud dynasty in Saudi Arabia. Tomorrow, if North Korea were to
> > be
> > > discussed on this list, I would be certain that there will be clear
> > > arguments on this list against the imbecilic regime that rules North
> > Korea
> > > at the moment. The list can be justifiedly expanded to include Iran,
> > the
> > > United States, Russia and many other countries and states.
> > >
> > > Saudi Arabia is one of the most horrible places on the planet. It is
> > ruled
> > > by a corrupt, decadent ruling elite and kept in place by money,
> > weapons
> > > and
> > > influence wielded by British and American corporate intersts and
> > foreign
> > > policy. If the international community was justified in operating a
> > set of
> > > sanctions against the hated South African apartheid regime, it should
> > have
> > >
> > > no business in cosying up to the sexist, slave-owning, xenophobic,
> > > anti-semitic Saudi regime which is the favourite retirement support
> > agency
> > > of third rate dictators like Idi Amin and corrupt rulers like Nawaz
> > > Sharif.
> > >
> > > The Saudi Monarchy, which rose to eminence as the stooge of British
> > > foreign
> > > policy in the middle east in the early twentieth century presides over
> > an
> > > imbecilic and paranoid gloss of Islam, and the particularly Salafist
> > brand
> > >
> > > of Islam that is held out as an ideal by the Saudi monarchy and its
> > rented
> > > clerics is rightly rejected by the majority of Muslims in the world.
> > Its
> > > significance lies only in that it is backed by petro-dollars and
> > American
> > > fighter jets.
> > >
> > > One does not have to link the decadence of current Saudi Arabia to the
> > > venality of Moditva/Hindutva. They are two different kinds of
> > abominations
> > > that need to be fought, and fought till they are destroyed. I would be
> >
> > > just
> > > as happy to see Salafist Islamo-fascism perish in Saudi Arabia, as I
> > would
> > > be to see the short, sharp end of Moditva and Hindutva in Gujarat and
> > in
> > > India.
> > >
> > > regards.
> > >
> > > Shuddha
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 2:13 pm 11/30/07 "Pawan Durani" < pawan.durani at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Would Someone Puhleez link this to Modi , RSS & Hindutva
> > > > ..........some intellectual surely would ..............
> > > >
> > > > http://www.themuslimwoman.org/
> > > >
> > http://www.themuslimwoman.org/entry/rape-victim-ordered-200-lashes-and
> > > > -prison-by-saudi-judges/
> > > > What can be called a travesty of judiciary, the Saudi Arabia's
> > Higher
> > > > Judicial Council has actually sentenced a rape victim to receive 200
> >
> > > > lashes and prison while the perpetrators of humanity's most heinous
> > > > crime were allowed to walk free.
> > > >
> > > > The 19-year-old Shiite woman who was raped by six armed men was
> > > > originally sentenced to receive 90 lashes for traveling in the car
> > of
> > > > an 'unrelated male' at the time of the rape. However after the woman
> > > > had the temerity of not unquestioningly submitting herself to be
> > > > tortured as punishment of being raped, the judges on Saudi Arabia's
> > > > Higher Judicial Council more than doubled her punishment for
> > > > attempting to influence the judiciary through the media.
> > > >
> > > > Her lawyer, human right activist Abdul Rahman al-Lahem, has been
> > > > banned from carrying her case further. His license has been revoked
> > > > and he has been called to appear before a disciplinary committee for
> >
> > > > challenging the judgment, which only punished the victim of the
> > crime
> > > > and not its perpetrators. The Sunni rapists were given a paltry
> > > > sentence of one to five years of imprisonment.
> > > >
> > > > This is the horrendous state of a country that keeps its women
> > > > forcefully behind veils only to extenuate and encourage heinous
> > > > crimes against them in the name of maintaining social discipline.
> > > > _________________________________________
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> > _________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
> Partha Dasgupta
> +919811047132