[Reader-list] Fwd :Fran�s Gautier ...

Sat Jun 16 11:54:18 IST 2007

Aishwariya and Fatima,
Thanks for making some very good points and thereby
enriching this debate on freedom of expression.
The concept of "freedom of expression" is never
absolute,but it is governed by certain ethical and
normative assumptions of the time,place and people
concerned.Isaiah Washington was fired from a Tv soap
in the US for calling his gay colleague
"faggot".Michael Richard's ass was fried for using the
word "nigger".
One of the european countries which were printing
Prophet Mohammad pbuh's cartoons with gay  
abandon actually have criminal laws to prosecute
someone who questions the validity of the genocide of
the jews in the WW.Go figure!
 Will any of the champions of the freedom of
expression take up their case? I think not.
The reason why "Freedom of expression" is cited by the
media when someone insults(knowing or unknowingly)
Hindu symbols in India and Muslim symbols in the west
is the inherent disapproval in media of these two
religions in these places, in the current climate.That
was my 2-bit attempt at deconstruction:)
If I see myself as liberal and tolerant and want to
foster a liberal and tolerant society,I should care
about,recognize and respect value systems that are
antithetical to my own. If I as an upper caste atheist
Hindu become a champion of LGBT rights or reservation
for deprived classes that does NOT make me
liberal\tolerant because in principle I identify
with,agree and support these causes.
Fatima has talked about solutions.I think that those
who have a voice should raise it beyond stating the
obvious that Hussain should have the freedom to do
it.He should get called for bad taste.
Any amount of reductionist political correctness cant
take away from the fact that the paintings were in bad
taste.Lets see three types of responses from
(possibly) the same person.
1.If I had understood art,I would probably(possibly?)
have declared them as great works of art!
2.As a civil libertarian,I would champion the right of
Hussein's freedom of expression and support his right
to not be lynched and not be subjected to shiv sainiks
protesting in their undies outside his house!
3.As a liberal AND tolerant individual,I would also
make the observation that Hussein's paintings are in
bad taste, because they are so obviously offensive to
a large group of people.
I dont see any contradiction in the same person making
these 3 statements.
If the religious men/women in the street (and our
homes)find a voice in the media,they would probably
not find it necessary to take their protest directly
to Hussein.The artist would also probably feel the
onus to  explain and refrain from unnecessary
sensationalism.
rgds
Rahul
--- Syed Yunus <delhi.yunus at gmail.com> wrote:

> DEAR ALL,
> 
> I Dont  know answers but  all three ( 
> hussain,Gautier,& salman) have
> learnt the art (or science) of getting attention .
> 
> Gautier has got good obseravation skills,infact
> great . probably thats
> why he is good in playing with words and  feelings
> of people . but I
> am surprised to listen the sermon on democracy  from
> him ( & the old
> debate about politics) .
> 
> Probably I should mention here that he has has
> recieved  the
> Nachiketa award of journalism from L.K.ADVANI ( and 
> we will have all
> our major roads and buildings named after him).
> because being an
> OUTSIDER he has written on the issue of kashmiri
> pandits.  since it is
> a sensitive and provocative issue for the Hindus ,
> he get large
> numbers of supporters who cant afford to disagree
> because of their
> ignorance.
> 
> He has also put together an exhibition of paintings
> on aurangzeb,
> interpreted from some where  by some one with out
> mentioning the
> actuals facts ( though the forum is know by FACT
> Fight Against
> Contunity of Terrorsism)
> thus he understands  'Democracy'...well and speaks
> the same language
> as the great proponents of  Hindutwa.( or probably
> it is just becasue
> of his marriage with a Hindu lady).
> 
> let us wait for another award for this great
> journalist.
> 
> Long live the distorted history,
> 
> 
> On 6/15/07, S Fatima <sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in>
> wrote:
> >
> > "Boring" and "trite", yes you've proved my point,
> > Amitabh. We, who produce or consume "high" art,
> are
> > too bored to go to the masses to explain what good
> art
> > is. I can't think of any effort made by the
> serious
> > contemporary artist to reach out to the people.
> And my
> > remarks are not for Hussain alone - these are for
> the
> > entire elitist art community which produces only
> for
> > galleries which have to be reserved for a show
> several
> > years in advance these days.
> >
> > I am sorry I am constantly taking this entire
> argument
> > away from Gautier and friends, but my point (about
> > education system) was to show that it is possible
> to
> > spread the "awareness" however boring it may
> sound.
> > One big example is our classical music (as
> abstract as
> > modern paintings) which is being appreciated by
> more
> > and more young people now thanks to SPIC-MACAY and
> > other similar efforts. If classical musicians can
> talk
> > to youngsters and inculcate at least some interest
> in
> > them (although I may not agree with SPIC-MACAY's
> > version of things), why can't painters go to the
> > people.
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Amitabh Kumar <amitabh at sarai.net> wrote:
> >
> > > "If our education system had taught us how to
> > > appreciate good
> > > art, how to read a painting,.."
> > >
> > > I think blaming our education system is an
> argument
> > > that borders the trite
> > > and is screeching towards boredom.
> > >
> > > Q: Do artists disconnect from people/masses or
> is it
> > > vice versa? What is
> > > this disconnect and how can it be cured by
> > > 'spreading awareness'?
> > >
> > >  If Hussain's work instigates any reaction in a
> > > person ( be it of anger,
> > > enjoyment, fear, condescension... ) I think
> perhaps
> > > a way to engage with it
> > > would be to actually go and find out what is
> causing
> > > that reaction. There is
> > > little that can be achieved by way's of trying
> to
> > > 'educate' the 'masses'
> > > about contemporary art.
> > > And  to the best of my knowledge,this effort has
> > > already been once made when
> > > in the 80's the mayor of Bombay had publicly
> > > displayed the works of Hussain
> > > and other distinguished artists out in the open.
> The
> > > artists would engage
> > > with the 'common man' and the work would be
> > > discussed.
> > > Once again, the source of this information might
> be
> > > a rumor.
> > >
> > >  I, personally, am not a huge fan Hussain's work
> and
> > > that has got nothing to
> > > do with him painting a nude goddess or which
> > > religion or creed he belongs to
> > > or how much his work sells or the feeling of
> being
> > > betrayed by his '
> > > disconnected'-ness. It's an opinion that is
> informed
> > > by my aesthetic
> > > sensibilities. And what my notion of a good
> thought
> > > provoking work is.
> > >
> > > Have all the provacation associated with
> Hussain's
> > > come from within the work
> > > or from sources outside ?
> > > Sadly, all the provocation associated with
> Hussain's
> > > work comes from outside
> > > of it.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 6/15/07, S Fatima < sadiafwahidi at yahoo.co.in>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Well, I mentioned about the education system
> and
> > > the
> > > > elitism - that's the answer. As long as Husain
> > > > continues to paint for the drawing rooms of
> the
> > > > billionares, he will continue to hide in
> London.
> > > If
> > > > some of our artists could go to the schools
> > > holding
> > > > workshops - even in RSS shakhas - to explain
> why
> > > they
> > > > paint what they paint, wouldn't that make a
> > > > difference.
> > > > You need to come down from your pedestal to
> bring
> > > any
> > > > change. You can't sit in the ivory towers and
> > > blame
> > > > the poor.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- Jeebesh Bagchi < jeebesh at sarai.net> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 15-Jun-07, at 12:37 PM, S Fatima wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > because they can't come to the street
> > > > > > to explian why they wrote or painted what
> they
> > > > > did.
> > > > >
> > > > > And how are we suppose to achieve this? Any
> > > ideas?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> 
=== message truncated ===

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