[Reader-list] Gandu world, words, Ajay and Raju
MRSG
mrsg at vsnl.com
Tue Mar 4 20:44:36 IST 2008
Mr. Kirdar Singh, how do you know MRSG is a hindu? What I have written on
Muhammad (marrying own adopted son's wife and Ayesha's affair in the desert)
is quite well known. Muhammad's marriage to his adopted son's former wife,
Zaynab bint Jashplease can be found in any standard text on this subject.
How Ayesha got lost in desert and then to clear her up from charges,
Muhammad got a new revealation - these are well discussed issues. Please
take a little pain to find those.
Thanks
----- Original Message -----
From: "kirdar singh" <kirdarsingh at gmail.com>
To: "inder salim" <indersalim at gmail.com>; <mrsg at vsnl.com>; <vivek at sarai.net>
Cc: <reader-list at sarai.net>
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 5:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Gandu world, words, Ajay and Raju
Dear Vivek
I have been following some of your mails. Its interesting to note that
some ordinary emails coming to your inbox go into the "Bullshit"
folder, while the literal bullshit goes into the ordinary folder, and
you even come to defend it. What's bullshit for MRSG is vlaueable for
you and vis a versa.
Look I have no problem with the intention of Inder Salim's story - I
don't need a justification for it. I appreciate the collective past
and the ontology and so on. But I do have a problem with the language
and symbolism. You won't care to react to it but I take MRSG's
following phrase very seriously:
"Everytime one Salim starts like this, it will be replied like this."
Now I know Inder Salim will not care to clarify to MRSG what his
religious identity is, or the fact that he is neither a Muslim nor a
Hindu (and I respect and appreciate that). But are you happy about the
fact that your posting has been simply misunderstood by someone as a
"provocation by a Muslim" and it naturally has to be replied with a
further provocation to all Muslims. The entire internet is full of
such provocative and abusive debates between Hindus and Muslims.
Inder, you mentioned rabid communalization in your rejoinder (which
you are against), but isn't your original post (due to its sheer
creative language) leading to further rabidity (unless you clarify).
But I think that's what most of us don't want to do - we do not want
to simplify and straighten our communication since it would no longer
be creative. All the problems of this world (which you have mentioned,
Inder) need clarifications, dialogue, clearing of misunderstandings
first. Art and black humour can come later. That's my opinion - you
may disagree.
Kirdar
(and by the way, MRSG, could you specify a source from which you got
the "history" about Muhammad and his indulgences)
On 3/3/08, inder salim <indersalim at gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear all,
> Let us ask ourselves, why we don't get provoked by the rampant
> corruption, environmental disaster, violence against women, rabid
> communalism, sheer poverty etc etc..,
>
> How to define a proud Indian?
>
> Who is a good Hindu, a good Muslim a good Christian in a societal set
> up where every other commodity is full of adulteration, and where lies
> and dishonesty rules the roost, and where success is measured by the
> brand of the car you own. Thus, tell me please, how to describe
> madness even.
>
> Yes, mob violence. Don't we often indulge in it, with this excuse that
> the law lets these petty thieves off the hook, so death sentenced is
> announced and executed instantly. No Karuna rasa ( compassion ) in a
> great country called Bharat, but how to understand this country which
> is plagued with lawlessness. Of course the law efficiently functions
> when a decent looking judge sits across a poor petty under trail
> thief. And when the frustrated thief manages to throw shit on Judge's
> face, we loose no time to show sympathy with the learned judge. The
> petty thief is dirt, simply a nuisance. The rest of us are genteel and
> decent citizens of shining India.
>
> And this John Nobody called inder salim is pointing out all this for
> his own personal greed. ( I am in no mood to forgive myself even,
> seriously )
>
> Now how to define a sacred space in our country. Is not Delhi's
> Akshardam Temple a land grab? And why only that, most of temples ,
> gurudwaras and mosques are erected illegally on government lands.
> The land which belongs to the millions of landless of people of India.
> Just try it out, place a Rama, Sita and Hanuman Image under a Pipal
> tree, and next weak you have a temple with a space for a Panwari
> corner shop.
>
> And who am I to ask, why Rama and Krishna are always clean shaved in
> every sacred calendar. Of course, that is the people's choice, but do
> they care to lift such an images from a gutter if a they happens to
> see it there. None. This example, can be applied to all believers. But
> if somebody, creatively adds to the existing imagery, then these very
> individual join their heads to set ablaze anything that comes their
> way. This way, they sometimes come to power even, and that they are
> free to explore this possibility endlessly. And when this does not
> work for them then a UP-Bihari worker becomes garbage in Mumbai.
>
> Just as an example, I don't think it is shameful to talk about the
> number of wives of Rama's father King Dashratha. Epics are made of
> such stuff, we know, but when a believer criticizes a Muslaman for
> their right to have more than one wife, then King Dashtratha too comes
> in picture. And now I am the villain because I pointed it out, Is not
> this absurd?
>
> I have seen some Muslim friends often talking about the greatness of
> Islam, True there is some degree of positive thought in every sacred
> scripture, but how come Hindu-Caste like thing exists in Muslim world
> as wel. And if I point it out, I am the villain, Is not this absurd ?
>
> It is often said, that Salman Rushdie's Satanic verses gave birth to
> Muslim Terrorism, and of course our own MF Hussain sired BajrangDal,
> VHP and Co. It was this stupid Taslima Nasreen who exposed the pseudo
> -liberalism of Bengali Left. The world would have been a peaceful
> place to live in if these Salman Rushdies, Hussains and Taslimas were
> not born.
>
> The challenge indeed is how to keep on talking to other without
> dislodging the decorum of hurling words on each other. I believe,
> there is no full stop in a discourse…
>
> What do you think dear Mr. Kirdar?
>
> With love and regards
> is
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 8:29 PM, kirdar singh <kirdarsingh at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > I am extremely pained to read these mails which in the name of free
> > expression provoke people beyong their limits - as it is the sanity on
> > this list is hanging by a thin thread.
> >
> > MRSG simply needed an excuse to bring out his latent hatred and
> > deep-rooted bias against Mohammad and Islam, but I would blame Inder
> > Salim equally for starting it all. I would humbly request you not to
> > continue your story any further - it would be better if you stand on
> > the road and narrate it to the people.
> >
> > (By the way, MRSG, who told you Mohammad had a son?)
> >
> > Kirdar
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 3/3/08, MRSG <mrsg at vsnl.com> wrote:
> > > Waiting for a story on Mohammad who rapes his own son's wife and
> > make
> > > it legal so that everybody can do that. Ofcourse his youngest wife
> > Ayesha
> > > enjoys herself with others in the desert to teach him a lesson.
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "inder salim" <indersalim at gmail.com>
> > > To: <reader-list at sarai.net>
> > > Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 8:55 AM
> > > Subject: [Reader-list] Gandu world, words, Ajay and Raju
> > >
> > >
> > > > On the banks of dead River Yamuna, a place adjacent to Nigmbodh
> > Gaht (
> > > > Crematorium in Delhi)
> > > >
> > > > Raju ( worker at Crematorium ): Do you know why they say Ram Ram
> > , Ram
> > > >
> > > > Ram when they bring a 'laash' ( corpse) for burning.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay ( another worker at Crematorium ): How do I know? I never
> > went to
> > > > school, But you gandu ( Gandu is someone who get his ass
> > screwed,
> > > > rather relishes the act ), you also don't know.
> > > >
> > > > Raju : but I saw it on the Television. A Guru said that people
> > call
> > > > Ram Ram to come to take this ' laash' corpse back .
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: And he comes and takes it back.( hands over his ganja
> > chilam to
> > > > Raju)
> > > >
> > > > Raju: Yes, because everybody is a Ravana, and on behalf of the
> > dead (
> > > > laash ) , people say Ram, Ram. Because Ravana also
> > uttered Ram
> > > > Ram
> > > > when he died by the arrow of Bhagwan Rama.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: Aray Chootiya, Ravana was a Gandu. He kidnapped Sita Mata.
> > But
> > > > how are we Ravana then.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: I don't know, but this is how, a guru maharaj said on the
> > > > Television. ( returns back his chilam to Ajay )
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: He too is Gandu
> > > >
> > > > Raju: Look, we also do bad things. That is why.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: which bad thing I do ? Ma-ki choot, ( mother's vagina), we
> > are
> > > > dying for a two square meals, and you say that we are
> > bad.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: We are not bad, but this is what he said. Achha, tell me,
> > don't
> > > > you go to sleep with a Gashti ( prostitute ) living
> > just
> > > > over there.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: yes, of course, we both go, so what. We pay her. All the
> > rich
> > > > people do it, and so what is wrong with it.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: No I don't say it like that, but do you know that the girl
> > you
> > > > sleep with was kidnapped once.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: How do I know? I never get time to ask the silly
> > questions,
> > > > behenchod, you ejaculate quickly, and that is why you get
> > time
> > > > to ask
> > > > all these questions.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: No, I was thinking, is not a little Ravana in all of us
> > who
> > > > fucks the kidnapped girl.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: Aray, chootiaya, the prostitute we sleep with is happy,
> > not
> > > > like Sita Mata who wanted to return back to meet her
> > husband
> > > > and God
> > > > Rama.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: But, imagine, if she was kidnapped at a very tender age,
> > and
> > > > think who would have come to rescue her.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: yes, you are right, I never thought like this.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: and see the unfortunate thing, Sita Mata was banished by
> > Lord
> > > > Rama because people questioned her purity while in
> > > > possession of evil
> > > > Ravana.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: And he really banished her?
> > > >
> > > > Raju: Yes, when she was pregnant, and helpless.
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: And gandu people say Ram Ram Ram Ram when some one dies.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: They should say Sita Sita Sita Sita
> > > >
> > > > Ajay: Array, behenchod, you are a mind eater, and that is why I
> > don't
> > > > smoke with you. Now, before we go, make one last chilam.
> > > > This world is
> > > > a fucking place. Forget who is saying what and why.
> > > >
> > > > Raju: You are right, meray yaar ( my friend ), give me the
> > light...
> > > >
> > > > (2)
> > > >
> > > > Just quenched my thirst, but I am thirsty. Who am I? I am not
> > > > thirsty, but I am about to quench my thirst. Who am I?
> > > > Just, writing lines like these makes me a poet, you know, but
> > poetry
> > > > is deeper than-this-than-this known outburst of words loaded
> > > > artificially with a deeper question on desire.
> > > >
> > > > Poetry is perhaps, oscillating between the mouth which eats
> > bread and
> > > > the anus which makes more space for the mouth to eat more. But
> > it just
> > > > happens that a mirror like thing sits in front of our eyes in
> > such a
> > > > way that we often end up seeing just the mouth-eating-the-bread
> > area.
> > > >
> > > > Rest of it is often dismissed as shit, you know.
> > > >
> > > > Even now, this typing these words is at the level of a projected
> > > > profile, the same which shows each one of us our upper frontals
> > called
> > > > 'faces' in the mirror. So this activity of writing words at the
> > best
> > > > is a meaningful time pass.
> > > >
> > > > Yes, only if a plain reflector piece would accompany the bread
> > piece I
> > > > eat, which if smoothly journeys the alimentary canal and beyond,
> > then
> > > > I can expect to see the truer nature of words. But that is
> > unlikely,
> > > > since almost everything what we imagine is innocently handed
> > over to
> > > > words, which shapes it accordingly to its own set of rules, let
> > alone
> > > > this impossible task of devouring a mechanism that links each
> > known
> > > > with the each unknown; so that we can draw the circle, which is
> > the
> > > > wisest of all.
> > > >
> > > > It almost sounds that I want to pick up words-born-in-shit with
> > > > forceps, like thread-worms from the lower colon, and arrange
> > them on a
> > > > black slate outside. They of course will dancingly speak a
> > language,
> > > > but sooner they will cease to be.
> > > >
> > > > By now, you saw, how desperately I try to write a good poem with
> > the
> > > > stock of words already available with me, which I naively
> > believe is
> > > > vital for the survival of a human being, Forget the poem, all I
> > > > managed to do is to humiliate the being of words, words which
> > perhaps,
> > > > betrayed me in the past; so this character assassination of
> > words. Is
> > > > that true?
> > > >
> > > > No, the mask, has all the reasons to celebrate. If the mask
> > jumps, so
> > > > does the thing behind the mask. Two words written by two lovers
> > can
> > > > hug, kiss and make love even. One word can fall in love with
> > other
> > > > word. One word can impregnate the other, and become a mother of
> > > > children- words. The words, after a little growth, can sit
> > around the
> > > > mother-word and listen a bed time story even.
> > > >
> > > > So, accordingly, one can write about a daily wage labourer, who
> > makes
> > > > his living by working hard under the Indian exploitative
> > conditions.
> > > > He curses his chootiya fate for being so, but believes that God
> > is
> > > > supreme, and it is He who has written his destiny like that. Ah,
> > this
> > > > business of writing the fates of others. I should not, if I too
> > > > believe that God has indeed written his fate, then why on earth
> > I need
> > > > to imitate that silly habit of writing fates of others. But then
> > I
> > > > have reasons to write about this poor man. If indeed God has
> > written
> > > > his fate, then I should re-write his fate. But I firmly believe
> > that
> > > > God does not exist, and if so, then nothing was ever written for
> > us
> > > > mortals on this earth. We collectively own our past. Our
> > misfortunes,
> > > > if any, were written by the billions and billions of our
> > predecessors.
> > > > And since they are living within us as well, we are experiencing
> > their
> > > > fates too. Are not we a conglomeration of echoes and traces of
> > our
> > > > past? Ontologically we are moving to and fro, so we may write
> > a word
> > > > or not even, the fact of being of our existence remains =85
> > > >
> > > > ( to be continued..
> > > > _________________________________________
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> > >
> > > _________________________________________
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> > > Critiques & Collaborations
> > > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
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> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> http://indersalim.livejournal.com
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