[Reader-list] Obama on Gandhi and other things - The "OUTLOOK" interview

[Kshmendra Kaul]

Extract:
 
"""" 'Throughout my life, I have always looked to Mahatma Gandhi as an inspiration, because he embodies the kind of transformational change that can be made when ordinary people come together to do extraordinary things""""
 
 
"OUTLOOK" Magazine Jul 21, 2008 
exclusive interview
ASHISH KUMAR SEN 
 
Q: In what ways would President Barack Obama be different from President John McCain on issues of foreign policy? 

A: I will end a war in Iraq that I opposed from the beginning. I will talk to all nations—friend and foe—because the Bush administration policy of not talking to leaders we don't like has not worked. I will finish the fight in Afghanistan, and refocus our approach on Pakistan. I am the only candidate who expressed early and regular concern about putting all of our eggs in the Musharraf basket and who has made it clear that we must do more to destroy Al Qaeda's sanctuary along the Afghan-Pakistan border. 


I will pursue a foreign policy in which America leads by example and principle, one in which we reject torture without equivocation and respect basic human rights and civil liberties. More fundamentally, the world will see a new face of America the day that I am elected, and I will bring a new kind of experience to the Oval Office.My understanding of global challenges has not just been shaped in the corridors of power; it has been shaped by the wider world. 


My father crossed an ocean to seek the dream of America. As a boy, I lived for several years in Indonesia. As a young man, I worked as a community organiser in the forgotten corners of America. So whether I am at an international summit or travelling the world, I will speak not just as someone who mastered my brief, but also as someone who has a grandmother who lives in a village in Africa without running water and indoor plumbing. I will be a president who works to strengthen our relations not just with world leaders, but with the world's people. 
 
 
That is reflected both in my approach to leadership, and in my policies, which include doubling American foreign assistance to $50 billion, making the UN's goal—which is America's as well—of halving extreme poverty by 2015. My foreign policy will seek to enhance freedom not by top-down ideological mandate, but by expanding the rule of law, transparent democratic institutions, bottom-up economic growth, education, and access to public health and technology. 


Q: You talk of change. What is the sort of change that you hope to bring about in Washington? 


A: The change I will bring to Washington is an extraordinary ground-up involvement by the American people. My campaign has energised Americans who have never before been involved in the political process. Their energy and the mandate for change that they embody will help us break out of the stalemate that has gripped our public policy. 


For far too long, Washington has been trapped in the same conventional thinking and the same partisan battles among the same actors. It is time to move past our divisions, and rally all Americans—Democrats, Independents and Republicans—around a common purpose. It is this energy of the American people that will help us to push back against the special interests that have blocked progress, and reduce the influence of Washington lobbyists. 


It is the American people who will help us move beyond a view of national security that values tough talk over sound judgement, a mindset that led us into a war in Iraq that I opposed from the beginning. With the American people's engagement and commitment to change, we can finally make progress on the challenges that we face year after year after year—healthcare we can't afford; an energy policy that we cannot sustain; and an America that is less safe and less respected in the world. We can turn the page to a new era of American leadership and prosperity. 


In terms of foreign policy, the change I will bring to Washington is experience of a different, critical sort. If I go to a poor country and speak about both the US obligation to work with poor countries to relieve suffering, and also the responsibility of poor countries to clear up corruption and increase transparency and rule of law and build their civil service, I do so with the credibility of someone with a grandmother who lives in an impoverished village in Africa. 


In the same way, if I call a summit of Muslim world leaders, I think that I can speak credibly to them about the fact that I respect their culture, that I understand their religion, that I have lived in a Muslim country, and as a consequence I know it is possible to reconcile Islam with modernity and respect for human rights and a rejection of violence. As I have said before, that doesn't mean that Muslim leaders will automatically act on the American agenda if it's contrary to what they perceive to be their self-interests.But at least there's an added element of trust. 


Q: Your critics say that in a match-up between Senator John McCain and you, he has the upper hand on foreign policy and national security experience. Do you believe you have suitable expertise on these two issues to match Senator McCain in November? 


A: I will bring a record of sound and better judgement on the key national security challenges that America has faced in recent years, and a vision for the future that is far different than Senator McCain's. I opposed the war in Iraq from the beginning and will end it as president; Senator McCain has been one of the staunchest supporters of the war, and wants to keep US troops in Iraq indefinitely. I have called for tough and direct diplomacy with US adversaries like Iran; Senator McCain wants to continue the failed Bush policy of not talking to our adversaries. 
 
 
I have called for a change in our Pakistan policy, so that we emphasise support for democracy and social and economic development, not only counter-terrorism; Senator McCain supported a policy of unconditional support for President Musharraf that did not work. We must align ourselves with Pakistan and its people, not just one individual. 


I will offer the American people a clear contrast with John McCain and a clean break from the foreign policy failures of the Bush-Cheney years. 


Q: The US and Indian governments are struggling to push through a civilian nuclear agreement. You had some concerns about this deal when it was debated in Congress. If the deal is not sealed by the end of the Bush administration, will an Obama administration in 2009 be willing to reopen it or do you think it should be scrapped? 

A: I voted for the US-India nuclear agreement because India is a strong democracy and a natural strategic partner for the US in the 21st century. As you point out, I had some concerns about the non-proliferation aspects of the original agreement when it was debated in Congress. But I also concluded that this agreement would enhance our partnership and deepen our cooperation. Once fully implemented, the nuclear deal would also aid in the important effort to combat global warming by allowing India to meet its growing electricity demands with nuclear energy rather than burning coal. 


A final judgement on the deal negotiated by the Indian and US governments in July 2007 must await the iaea's approval of a safeguards agreement with India and changes to be agreed (upon) by the Nuclear Suppliers Group. At that point, the US Congress will decide whether to approve the agreement. I continue to hope this process can be concluded before the end of the year. As a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, I will continue to make sure that our respective strategic, non-proliferation, and energy and environment interests are all advanced by the ultimate deal. 


Q: If you have concerns about the nuclear deal, what changes would you like to see? 


A: The existing agreement effectively balanced a range of important issues—from our strategic relationship with India to our non-proliferation concerns to India's energy needs.I am therefore reluctant to seek changes. 


Q: Many in the Indian-American community are firm Clinton supporters because they see President Bill Clinton as the man who engaged India with his historic visit. In what ways will you be a better president for US-India relations? 


A: My campaign has enjoyed strong and deep support from the very beginning from the Indian-American community, including support from many leading Indian-Americans who served in the Clinton administration. That community support is deepening at every stage of our effort. 
 
 
Both President Clinton and President Bush did many important things to strengthen the US-India relationship. I will work energetically to build on the work of the last two US administrations and move forward to forge an even closer strategic partnership between our two countries. 


Q: In what areas would you like to see US-India relations grow? 


Across-the-board would be the short answer. But let me elaborate with a few examples. I believe that the US and India must work together to combat the common threats of the 21st century. 
 
 
We are both victims of terrorist attacks on our soil, and our counter-terrorism partnership is based on a shared interest in defeating the forces of extremism. Our common strategic interests call for strengthening US-India military cooperation. We share an interest in democracy and the rule of law, and can work to promote democracy and strengthen legal institutions in South Asia and beyond. We share an interest in combating global climate change, and the US and India can both do more to lead the world in securing a cleaner and more sustainable energy future. I intend to increase energy cooperation with India so we can together address the climate crisis that threatens our planet. We share an interest in combating the spread of disease, including HIV/AIDS. And we share an interest in combating global poverty, which is why I will seek the UN's goal of halving extreme poverty by 2015. We cannot allow the world's neediest to be left behind. 
 
 
India has enormous potential to contribute to a shared, sustained global economic growth. Our agenda should also include strengthening our economic relationship on a mutually beneficial basis. I would also like to see agriculture given a higher priority in our relations, as India pursues its goal of a 'Second Green Revolution'. I would like to see a ramp-up in higher education collaboration in fields like science, public health and information technology. 


Q: Do you see closer US-India ties as a means to counterbalance the rise of China? 


A: The United States should seek to strengthen its bilateral relationship with India on its own merits, because of our many shared interests and our shared democratic values. The deeper relationship that I will seek is not about working against China or any other country—it is about addressing our common interests and common challenges for the 21st century. 


Q: President Clinton was criticised for visiting India very late in his presidency—when he was a lame duck president. Do you intend to visit India if you are elected president and how soon would you like to make this trip? 


A: President Clinton's visit to India was the first by a US president in 22 years. President Bush rightly followed suit and travelled to India. New Delhi is now a part of an American president's overseas travel while in office, just as it is to other capitals of our key allies and friends around the world.As president, I will continue this newly established tradition. 


Q: What is your stand on the dispute between India and Pakistan over Kashmir? Do you want the US to play a more active role in resolving this situation? 


A: I believe the US should encourage the existing and ongoing dialogue between India and Pakistan aimed at resolving the dispute over Kashmir. The US should be a strong supporter of this process, one that will, if ultimately successful, have enormous benefits for both India and Pakistan, and the region as a whole. 


Q: India has been a major beneficiary of outsourcing of jobs by US firms. You have talked about providing incentives to firms that keep jobs in the US. Do you believe the practice of outsourcing should be stopped altogether? 


A: Revolutions in communications and technology have sent jobs wherever there's an internet connection, and have forced workers in Chicago and Boston to compete for those jobs with workers in Bangalore and Beijing. We live in a more competitive world, and that is a fact that cannot be reversed. We know that we cannot and should not put up walls around our economy. 

 
But we must find a way to make globalisation and trade work for American workers. The American worker needs to be supported and given the tools needed to compete in the global economy. So I would pursue common-sense measures such as offering tax incentives to companies that create jobs in the US, undertaking policies such as supporting growth sectors like renewable energy and building up our infrastructure that will lead to creation of well-paying jobs and, most importantly, investing in education and job retraining programmes. The US has faced fundamental economic challenges before and it has met them by expanding opportunity outward, growing its middle class, and investing in the education and well-being of our workers. 


Q: Do you have any Indian influences in your life? 


A: My mother instilled in me from a very young age an interest in other cultures and exposure to their traditions, including Indian culture and traditions. As an anthropologist, she later did rural development work in India. In my own life, I am fortunate to have close Indian-American friends and I am proud to have the long-standing support of so many Indian-Americans in all aspects of my campaign. Throughout my life, I have always looked to Mahatma Gandhi as an inspiration, because he embodies the kind of transformational change that can be made when ordinary people come together to do extraordinary things. That is why his portrait hangs in my Senate office: to remind me that real results will come not just from Washington—they will come from the people. 


Q: Recently your campaign revealed that as a 19-year-old you travelled to Karachi and Hyderabad in Pakistan. Could you share some of these experiences with us? 


A: I travelled to Pakistan for about three weeks to visit a friend from college. What my experience taught me is that among the most important aspects of our foreign policy is not simply our relations with the rulers of countries, but also our appreciation and understanding of the challenges, the hardships, the struggles and the aspirations of ordinary people. 
 
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