[Reader-list] About Accusations on this List

[Pawan Durani]

Amen !

Pawan


On 11/14/08, yasir ~يا سر <yasir.media at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> dear moderator,
>
> if you do decide to expel the KPs concerned from the list, please do so so
> that they land in PK.
>
> this will give us a chance to show our hospitality. it may change a few
> minds
>
> regards
>
> yasir.pk
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 9, 2008 at 8:01 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta <shuddha at sarai.net
> >wrote:
>
> > Dear All,
> >
> > I have noticed a curious and remarkable phenomenon of late on our
> > list, and am wondering whether or not any of you have noticed it too.
> > Unfortunately it is not without precedent.
> >
> > We know well by now that when those who speak for 'Panun Kashmir' and
> > 'Roots in Kashmir' run out of arguments, especially when faced with
> > detailed and cross referenced material that does not support their
> > 'case', habitually retort with abuse, invective and insinuation. They
> > express their desires to 'spit' on people's faces, exactly as their
> > ABVP / Sri Ram Sena  goon allies spit on the faces of university
> > lecturers invited to speak at the university.
> >
> > Of late, there has been another kind of 'spitting' going on in this
> > list, and in the online communications emanating from individuals
> > associated with 'Panun Kashmir' and 'Roots in Kashmir'.
> >
> >  I am speaking about a curious pattern of a specific kind of
> > insinuations emanating mainly from Pawan Durani (but also of late
> > from Aditya Raj Kaul) that suggest that whosoever does not agree with
> > the PK/RIK gospel or the broad hardline Indian nationalist position
> > on anything must be doing so because they are actively doing the
> > bidding of their 'foreign masters' and further, because they are
> > being 'paid' to do so. Since their ethical horizons are severely
> > limited and compromised, the makers of these accusations cannot
> > imagine that some of us take a principled position against the things
> > that they hold sacrosant. And so, failing to account for the ethical
> > basis of our opposition, they leap to accuse us of being adversarial
> > purely for the sake of private and pecuniary gain. So, 'writers' and
> > journalists are paid by their terrorist masters, I am a paid agent,
> > Sanjay Kak was paid by Yasin Malik (this is a charge that was made
> > when the debate on Jashn-e-Azadi began) and Prakash Ray is 'Sanjay
> > Kak's propoganda agent on the payroll of Yasin Malik' , and so on.
> >
> > This allegation that ones critics are ones critics because they are
> > being paid to be critics and that too by devious foreign powers or
> > their local clients is the time tested 'foreign hand' and 'agent of
> > the foreign hand' theory that is the Brahmastra (secret lethal
> > weapon) that Indian politicians (and not only Indian politicians)
> > resort to when all else fails. It is the true hallmark of a failure
> > of reason, a profound disconnect with reality and dismal poverty of
> > the political imagination. It attempts to hide but fails to conceal a
> > rancid, rabid, raucous politics.
> >
> > Of course, as is evident from the emails forwarded by Sonia Jabbar on
> > to the list recently, some of the illustrious company that Mr. Durani
> > keeps, such as the gentleman known as Ashish Zutshi, another 'Roots
> > in Kashmir' luminary, himself offered her a 'reasonable sum of money'
> > to write for their cause. Perhaps the sleazy language of bribery is
> > the only one that these gentlemen understand, because at least in
> > this case, they seem to be doing precisely what (offering a bribe)
> > that they accuse us of being beholden to. Rather, this is a case of
> > one kind of influence peddlers admitting to the fact that they lament
> > not having their current adversaries as their own 'paid agents'. Why
> > else would they offer to pay someone who doesn't agree with them a
> > 'reasonable amount' to change her mind.
> >
> > In the last two weeks there have been several specific occasions when
> > either I, or someone broadly willing to question the PK/RIK hard line
> > nationalist gospel has been called a paid 'agent'. Further, Aarti has
> > been accused of selling herself 'cheaply' and Sanjay Kak has been
> > accused of taking money from Yasin Malik. And there have also been
> > two specific occasions when people (Aman and me, by implication) have
> > been called 'puppets of the Chinese'.
> >
> > Now this is something that I take quite seriously. I do not take this
> > casually, as I do not think that these accusations are made casually
> > either.
> >
> > The allegations suggest, basically, that some of us are writing what
> > we are writing on this list because some 'foreign power'  or
> > 'terrorist' is greasing our palms. Since I am included in this list,
> > I am willing to take on this matter personally. Notwithstanding the
> > fact that my bank accounts suggest otherwise, I am insulted to know
> > that Pawan Durani should think that my political convictions and
> > reflections are available for purchase at such low rates in the
> > market, or, more fundamentally, that I am a hired hack who writes not
> > out of conviction but  for the sake of crumbs and leavings from my
> > 'masters' table. The Reader List is a space of freedom. No one is
> > paid by the hosts  or the administrator of the list to write
> > anything. No payments are sought from the hosts or administrator for
> > any kind of writing either. My professional responsibilities at Sarai
> > do not include writing on the Reader List either.
> >
> > I consider this an insult to the community of the reader list, to the
> > Sarai programme at CSDS and a serious affront to my reputation and my
> > professional standing. I do not wish to ignore this or take it
> > lightly, especially as this has been made on a very public forum. I
> > may have been willing to ignore the odd barb of this nature (and it
> > is not that it has not been thrown in the past) but when we get seven
> > defamatory missives in two weeks, then we are looking at a serious
> > and determined pattern that I do not think deserves to be ignored or
> > overlooked.
> >
> > Let's look at each one of these instances. I have tagged each quote
> > with the subject header and the date of the posting from which it is
> > taken, so that they can be traced easily by all list members. My
> > comments follow each quotation. Certain portions within each
> > quotation have been capitalized for reasons of emphasis (mine).
> >
> > --------------------------
> > 1.
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] When will Muslims join the mainstream?
> > Date: 21 October 2008 6:21:56 PM GMT+05:30
> >
> > (from Pawan Durani)
> >
> > "...Notwithsatnding a well CALCULATED EFFORT BACKED BY A FOREIGN
> > COUNTRY , so called intellectuals and so called jornalists who
> > created a disinformation campaign, such as in Jamia Encounter ,
> > Parlaiment case are being followed more closely.
> >
> > Number of people are supposed to be under close scanner and their links
> > ascertained. Hoping the truth and the DETAILS PAYOUTS will come out
> > soon..."
> >
> > MY COMMENT: Pawan Durani claims to know the following -
> > (a) that those raising questions about the Jamia Encounter and the
> > Parliament Attack case are party to a 'well calculated effort backed
> > by a foreign country'
> > (b) that they are 'under a close scanner', their 'links are being
> > ascertained'
> > (c) that the 'details' of 'payouts' will come out soon...
> >
> > In all fairness, either he should furnish the list with details of
> > how he can substantiate (a - which foreign country?), (b) & (c)
> > above, or stand charged of making baseless allegations designed to
> > malign the character and reputation of people in a public forum.
> >
> > In the event that he cannot prove (a), (b) & (c) I would like to know
> > whether or not list members believe that this alone ought not to
> > count as sufficient reason for his expulsion from the list ?
> >
> > 2.
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] When will Muslims join the mainstream?
> > Date: 25 October 2008 3:53:21 PM GMT+05:30
> >
> > (from Pawan Durani)
> >
> > "...I know I am not a master of mixing words NOR IS THIS A FULL TIME
> > JOB FOR ME  FOR WHICH I GET PAID FOR..." (sic)
> >
> > MY COMMENT: This is specifically addressed to me. Since I am neither
> > employed nor monetarily compensated to write posts on the Reader List
> > on any subject whatsoever, and do so entierly of my own free will, I
> > want to know what Pawan Durani means when he implies that writing on
> > the Reader List is a 'full time job for which I get paid'. Again, if
> > he cannot substantiate this, it will amount to defamation because it
> > will imply that I say what I do, or have the political convictions
> > that I have because I am paid for this. In other words, that I am a
> > 'mercenary'. If he cannot substantiate this charge, I would again
> > like to ask whether he should be expelled from this list, or allowed
> > to continue to make allegations without basis?
> >
> > 3.
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] Thinking Through Figures on Internal Displacement
> > from Kashmir
> > Date: 1 November 2008 2:11:09 PM GMT+05:30
> >
> > (from Pawan Durani)
> >
> > "...Mind it , we are fighting for ourselves and IT IS A UNPAID JOB,
> > UNLIKE SOME SURROGATES WHO ACT PROXY for secessionists in Kashmir and
> > support their
> > cause by trying to create an opinion..."
> >
> > MY COMMENT: If what he is doing is an 'unpaid job' it implies, from
> > reading this and the previous quote, that I am doing a 'paid
> > job' (again because this is addressed to me). Once again, the
> > questions I have asked immediately before this still hold.
> >
> > 4.
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] Thinking Through Figures on Internal Displacement
> > from Kashmir
> > Date: 1 November 2008 5:17:49 PM GMT+05:30
> >
> > (from Pawan Durani)
> >
> > "...I dont have time like Shuddha for writing such a long mail, and
> > also IT IS NOT MY PAID JOB."
> >
> > MY COMMENT: Implication - it is Shuddha's "paid job" to write in the
> > way he does. See my previous two comments above. Same question holds
> >
> > 5.
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] Thinking Through Figures on Internal Displacement
> > from Kashmir
> > Date: 2 November 2008 12:37:24 PM GMT+05:30
> >
> > (from Pawan Durani)
> >
> > "We dont need him or his lip service. LET HIM SERVE HIS MASTERS and
> > we would continue to counter their agenda..."
> >
> > MY COMMENT: So providing a detailed set of arguments amounts to me
> > "serving" my "masters". Who are these "masters"? Does Durani have a
> > list of my "masters" or  any proof for the allegation that he is
> > making here that I write on the list at the bidding of "masters"? If
> > he does not have this proof, then again, I am constrained to ask
> > whether or not he should be expelled from the list for reasons of
> > defamation.
> >
> > 6.
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] Kashmiri Pandits demand 'internally displaced
> > persons' status
> > Date: 3 November 2008 1:33:03 PM GMT+05:30
> >
> > (from Pawan Durani)
> >
> > "...At least WE ARE NOT PUPPETS OF CHINESE IDEOLOGY. You know what I
> > mean."
> >
> > MY COMMENT: The implication here is that those who do not agree with
> > Pawan's position are the puppets of "Chinese ideology"? What does
> > "Chinese ideology" mean? Does it mean, Confucianism, Taoism, Maoism,
> > Kuomintang Thought, Dengism, Falun Gong tendencies or an unnatural
> > preference for Chinese cuisine?
> >
> > I take it (though, who knows, I could be wrong)  that Pawan is
> > referring to a willingness to act at the behest of 'Chinese' masters,
> > specifically those in positions of power within the Chinese Communist
> > Party and the government of the Peoples Republic of China.
> >
> > If so, how would he explain the fact that several of the people he
> > would identify as his adversaries (me, for instance) have been vocal
> > critics of Maoism (all varieties), the Chinese Communist Party and
> > the government of the Peoples Republic of China on this list. We have
> > in fact gone on record to point out the similarities between the way
> > in which the government of mainland China deals with Tibet, and the
> > way in which the Government of India deals with the occupation that
> > it undertakes in Kashmir.
> >
> > In the light of this fact, the above allegation is rendered baseless.
> >
> > 7.
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] Kashmiri Pandits demand 'internally displaced
> > persons' status
> > 3 November 2008 1:42:34 PM GMT+05:30
> >
> > (from Aditya Raj Kaul)
> >
> > "It has become so usual now to SEE THESE PUPPETS SPEAK THEIR MASTERS
> > TONE..."
> >
> > MY COMMENT: Here, Aditya Raj Kaul echoes Pawan Durani's insinuation
> > that anyone who questions them (him and Durani) are "puppets" who act
> > at the behest of their masters.
> >
> > -----------------
> >
> > Re: [Reader-list] SIMI Activists found with SAR Geelani CDs
> > 9 November 2008 14:14:12 IST 2008
> >
> > (from Aditya Raj Kaul)
> >
> > "dear SANJAY KAK'S PROPOGANDA AGENT ON PAYROLLS OF YASIN MALIK
> >
> > MY COMMENT: None
> > __________________________
> >
> > I am giving Pawan Durani and Aditya Raj Kaul exactly one day (from
> > the date and time of this posting) to furnish detailed,
> > substantiatable proof for what I consider to be the allegations in
> > their defamatory and scurrilous postings aimed at me and others on
> > this list.
> >
> > If they are not able to furnish these proofs within this one day. Or,
> > if the proofs they furnish are found to be insubstantial, motivated
> > and inadequate to the charges that they make, then I would request
> > the list administrator that both of them be expelled from this list
> > with immediate effect.
> >
> > Let me clarify one thing in closing. I am and have always been in
> > favour of freedom of expression. And I have defended (over the last
> > year and a half) the right of Pawan Durani and Aditya Raj Kaul and
> > their allies (in serious offline discussions) to continue to torment
> > this list with their rubbish time and time again when demands have
> > been made for his expulsion on grounds of 'hate speech'. I am willing
> > to go the extra mile to give the benefit of the doubt when someone
> > stands accused of 'hate speech' especially when I do not agree with
> > them, because I think that even things said in anger need a hearing.
> > And I have gone that extra mile with Pawan Durani, Aditya Raj Kaul
> > and their allies.
> >
> > But defamation and libel are offenses, not opinions. The harm that
> > they can do is objectively verifiable, not a matter of speculation or
> > conjecture. Opinions, no matter how vile they may be can be countered
> > by arguments and better formulated opinions. But the lies that attack
> > peoples personal lives and conduct, especially when they are uttered
> > on public fora, spread poison if they are not dealt with exemplary
> > and immediate severity. There have to be consequences for such
> > conduct, no matter who does it.
> >
> > If someone says that I am paid to speak in the way that I do by a
> > foreign power, then there is no ambiguity in this statement. EIther I
> > am, or I am not. I know I am not. The mails that I am referring to
> > above suggests that I am, and several others on the list are. And
> > since this is a statement about concrete people, not about some
> > abstractions . then the only way to settle this is to demand that the
> > person or persons making the allegation proves what they say, or
> > faces the consequences of bearing false witness. The reason I am
> > saying this is because there actually are very serious consequences
> > to being thought of as a 'paid' agent of a 'foreign power' in this
> > country, at a time like what we are going through, today. Such
> > accusations and labels cannot and must not be taken lightly.
> >
> > Either he is lying, or I am. And an untruth about a person is libel
> > and cannot by any stretch of imagination be subject to protection on
> > the grounds of freedom of expression. This forum would be betraying
> > itself and the reasons why it was founded if it confuses the license
> > to defame a person or persons with the freedom of expression.
> >
> > I hope I have made myself abundantly clear. I have nothing to conceal.
> >
> > regards
> >
> > Shuddha
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________
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