[Reader-list] About the list

Partha Dasgupta parthaekka at gmail.com
Fri Nov 14 18:17:25 IST 2008 

As one of the readers on the list, would be extremely glad if this game of
tit-for-tat were stopped here, and we move on to things more worthy of
attention.

Rgds, Partha
....................................

On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 6:15 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul <kauladityaraj at gmail.com>wrote:

>  "It is important to keep talking, even to one's presumed enemies, because
>  one day they will wake up"
>
> The Dalai Lama
>
> In this Spirit of the Great Dalai Lama, I talk to many and still think they
> would WAKE UP !!!
>
> Aditya Raj Kaul
>
> On 11/14/08, Aditya Raj Kaul <kauladityaraj at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Dear List Reader's,
> >
> > I was wrong when I thought that with the much needed e-mail by the 'List
> > Administrator' the matter would be resolved. But, unfortunately, there
> still
> > are people rigid on their autocratic stand, their ego is much more than
> the
> > smooth functioning of the group. One of them is Inder Salim, who now also
> > wants to become Prime Minister of India (In fact, knows he'll become
> > someday). Help our nation will someone!
> >
> > Inder Salim has an habit to drag things out to no bounds. He can just
> > exaggerate to no limits and is for no solution to any problem.
> >
> > There have been occasion when even we have been targeted and named with
> all
> > sorts of rubbish. But, you remain silent on it. Don't we deserve an
> apology
> > ? Or, you typically turn blind at this point. (Refer List archive for
> proof,
> > I don't have time these days honestly to hunt those points and links and
> > words and then post in this non-issue debate)
> >
> > Lastly, Inder Salim, I decided to ignore all these mails long back for
> the
> > best of this list and even all members who were annoyed with me and
> others.
> > But, unfortunately, you and your jhollahwallahs have still some patience
> > left to extend this already much extended issue.
> >
> > Kindly wake up and try to dwell upon issues of more importance, concern.
> >
> > And, I can bet Pawan Durani will prefer sucide rather then a so called
> > 'Bharat Ratna' from some Inder Salim.
> >
> > Are you sure you are Inder Salim ? To become a PM, before that a MP and
> > much before that a Politician (for which you qualify), you need a name
> and
> > identity proof. Who is Inder Tickoo ?
> >
> > Love
> > Aditya Raj Kaul
> >
> > On 11/14/08, inder salim <indersalim at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> you see pawan,
> >>
> >> i will reply in detail, again and again,  ( even, i have done many
> >> times already  ) but , just  provide proof to the allegations against
> >> Shuddha , i will take all the  arguments back, i will give u a bharat
> >> Ratna along with MF  Hussain.
> >>
> >> i mean it, as and when i will become Prime Minister of India.
> >>
> >> but for the sake of love,
> >> please please provide the proof,
> >>
> >> or simply say there were none, say sorry, ( which i know u wont )
> >>
> >> say something, u and aditya have lost credibility because of false
> >> allegations, ( i forget spitting and  other crap ) so come our
> >> bravely, come on young boy, come out  comrade, this is right time,
> >>
> >> else,  i have all the rights to ignore ur mails
> >>
> >> love
> >> is
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 4:10 PM, Pawan Durani <pawan.durani at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > Fatima ,
> >> >
> >> > You are wrong !
> >> >
> >> > Please start thinking and reading again.
> >> >
> >> > What Yasir wrote was that KP's needed to be removed and sent to PK .It
> >> was
> >> > not me who had anything like Kashmiri Pandit in my mind.
> >> >
> >> > I never said anyone who hates Kashmiri Pandits , perhaps like you ,
> >> should
> >> > be evicted. You have a right to hate anyone, as do I.
> >> >
> >> > The problem is that you are very crafty in putting words in others
> mouth
> >> and
> >> > provoking people to react and at the same time diverting from the main
> >> > content.
> >> >
> >> > And in this case it was Mr Tapas who called me a fascist creep and Mr
> >> Inder
> >> > who compared us to terrorists.
> >> >
> >> > Regards
> >> >
> >> > A fascist terror creep
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On 11/14/08, Fatima फ़ातिमा <fatimaschool45 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Dear Shuddha
> >> >> Of course I know that. You probably didn't see the last para of
> Pawan's
> >> >> mail where he sarcastically says:
> >> >>
> >> >> "I would not ask Mr Yasir of whether he should not be thankful to
> SARAI
> >> >> group
> >> >> hosted from India of being hospitable in true Indian traditions to
> have
> >> him
> >> >> here instead of asking SARAI to be hospitable of ejecting me from the
> >> >> group."
> >> >>
> >> >> By this he means that all Pakistanis (or Bangladeshis) are
> >> anti-Kashmiri
> >> >> Pundit, and have no right to being on the list, but it is our big
> heart
> >> that
> >> >> we are tolerating them. Isn't that true Pawan?
> >> >>
> >> >> Fatima
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 3:41 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta <
> >> shuddha at sarai.net>wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>>  Dear Fatima,
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> What's there to be thankful about? The reader list has never defined
> >> >>> itself along lines of nationality.  The 'indians' here are not
> hosts,
> >> and
> >> >>> the rest guests. We are all guests in each others time and
> >> attention.This is
> >> >>> not an 'Indian' list. Nor is it a list with any specific bias for or
> >> against
> >> >>> any nationality. In fact the question of nationality is irrelevant
> >> here. I
> >> >>> don't see how being 'Indian', or anything else should make any
> >> difference to
> >> >>> being on the list,
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> regards
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Shuddha
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>  On 14-Nov-08, at 3:06 PM, Fatima फ़ातिमा wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Yes Pawanji,
> >> >>> All foreigners (like Yasir Pakistani, and Naeem Bangladeshis, Britta
> >> >>> European and others) should be thankful to Sarai for allowing them
> to
> >> be its
> >> >>> members. In true Indian tradition, we allow all anti-nationals here
> -
> >> we
> >> >>> have a big heart.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Fatima
> >> >>>
> >> >>> On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 2:31 PM, Pawan Durani <
> pawan.durani at gmail.com
> >> >
> >> >>> wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> I strongly believe that no one should be told to hold back. I do
> not
> >> mind
> >> >>>> being called a fascist or a creep by Tapas nor do I mind being
> >> compared
> >> >>>> with
> >> >>>> terrorists by Inder .
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> There is a difference when people express themselves , thier
> >> intentions
> >> >>>> and
> >> >>>> ideology. When Aditya wrote "Dumbocracy" , he was blunt , however
> >> what is
> >> >>>> being exhibited here by Mr Tapas and Mr Inder is exactly a
> reflection
> >> of
> >> >>>> what Aditya wrote.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Having said that , I would love to see more reactions from these
> >> >>>> gentlemen.
> >> >>>> I do not and would not write back the same classy words they chose
> .,
> >> nor
> >> >>>> would i ask Mr Tapas his intention of defaming hindu community in
> >> >>>> disguise
> >> >>>> of being secular . I would not ask him what holds him back of not
> >> >>>> mentioning
> >> >>>> destruction of temples in Kashmir when he choose to mention Babri
> >> >>>> structure
> >> >>>> - Ram Mandir and neither would I ask him why he does not write
> >> burning of
> >> >>>> train in Godhra while mentioning terrible events in Gujarat. I
> would
> >> not
> >> >>>> ask
> >> >>>> him if he has memory failing in both of these ? I would not ask him
> >> why
> >> >>>> he
> >> >>>> does not balance what he writes.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Inder Ji is a member of my KP community and I have many times tried
> >> to
> >> >>>> avoid
> >> >>>> replying back to him . As you understand we are a very small
> >> community
> >> >>>> and
> >> >>>> chances of interacting or meeting each other is high . It would be
> >> sad
> >> >>>> that
> >> >>>> we have a history of fights should we meet each other in future .
> >> However
> >> >>>> I
> >> >>>> would not ask him , what makes him think we are like terrorists ,
> is
> >> it
> >> >>>> just
> >> >>>> we tell our 'victim' story and are still proud of being a Kashmiri
> >> Pandit
> >> >>>> .
> >> >>>> I would not ask him why he takes liberties of his art on those
> things
> >> >>>> which
> >> >>>> we hold in high esteem. He may have an answer that nude art may
> have
> >> been
> >> >>>> there in ancient hindu temples , but would Mr Inder be kind enough
> to
> >> >>>> share
> >> >>>> if the art did exist in martand temple in Kashmir , where Mr Inder
> >> did
> >> >>>> his
> >> >>>> own nude photography ? What may hold good in a Dargah may not hold
> >> good
> >> >>>> in a
> >> >>>> masjid . You don't find Qawaalis sung in mosques .....is it not ? I
> >> would
> >> >>>> not ask Mr Inder that again in the name of art what made him split
> a
> >> >>>> picture
> >> >>>> of Durga Goddess in two [ http://indersalim.livejournal.com/ ] . I
> >> would
> >> >>>> not
> >> >>>> ask him if he has ever wondered that his art may be hurting someone
> ?
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> I would still not ask those whole group of people , apart from Mr
> >> Shuddha
> >> >>>> ,
> >> >>>> why have they remained silent on wordings of Mr Tapas and Mr Inder
> >> and
> >> >>>> whether they approve of thhose words or not ?
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> I would not ask Mr Yasir of whether he should not be thankful to
> >> SARAI
> >> >>>> group
> >> >>>> hosted from India of being hospitable in true Indian traditions to
> >> have
> >> >>>> him
> >> >>>> here instead of asking SARAI to be hospitable of ejecting me from
> the
> >> >>>> group.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> For If i ask these two gentlemen , I would be a creep fascist ?
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Regards
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Pawan Durani
> >> >>>> This is my last mail on this subject.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> On 11/14/08, Shuddhabrata Sengupta <shuddha at sarai.net> wrote:
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > Dear Tapas, Dear Inder, dear all,
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > I would strongly urge you and everyone to temper and moderate
> your
> >> >>>> > language. Nothing is served by you or anyone calling anyone a
> >> 'fascist
> >> >>>> > creep'. The point about abuse has been effectively made. Let's
> move
> >> on
> >> >>>> now.
> >> >>>> > Please do not continue to exacerbate the situation by calling
> >> people
> >> >>>> > fascists. No political formation in India today is free of
> >> >>>> authoritarian and
> >> >>>> > fascist tendencies. And yes, I strongly believe that the only way
> >> to
> >> >>>> > confront fascism, wherever it exists, is with an open democratic
> >> >>>> culture
> >> >>>> > that privileges dialogue and reason. We cannot use fascist
> methods
> >> to
> >> >>>> combat
> >> >>>> > fascism, because then we become their mirrors and gradually we
> >> become
> >> >>>> > exactly like them.
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > Please safeguard and protect the democratic nature of your own
> >> >>>> commitment
> >> >>>> > to this space as a space of openness, dialogue and reason where
> all
> >> >>>> points
> >> >>>> > of view are welcome and can be debated in an open way. Lets not
> >> gang up
> >> >>>> on
> >> >>>> > anyone now, not even on those who may have ganged up on others
> >> before.
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > regards
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > Shuddha
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >  On 14-Nov-08, at 10:45 AM, Pawan Durani wrote:
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >  On 11/13/08, Tapas Ray <tapasrayx at gmail.com> wrote:<<<<<<<<<<<<
> >> in my
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > opinion - is that these members are (as we have stated recently)
> >> part
> >> >>>> of
> >> >>>> > the
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > fascist creep we have seen in India, which is becoming a thrust
> >> with
> >> >>>> every
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > passing day.  >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > Tapas,
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > Thank you for your wonderful statement, to which non of the
> member
> >> >>>> reacted.
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>> > Pawan
> >>
> >
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-- 
Partha Dasgupta
+919811047132

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