[Reader-list] Safety of list-members

Mon Nov 17 20:15:58 IST 2008

I can still understand your e-mail and maybe agree or disagree; but
unfortunately the last line of your e-mail speaks volumes about your sick
mentality. How did you bring in 'CASTE' here ? This is precisely your
problem, Shivam.

Work on it dude....or it will be a cure less disease.

Also, scan more of your e-mails from the archives and you will mind more
hatred, allegations etc.

Who did I say was a 'paid agent' ? Not you ?

Thanks

On 11/17/08, Shivam V <lists at shivamvij.com> wrote:
>
> Aditya,
>
> You needlessly drag my name here. I have never accused you, or anyone
> on this list, of being paid by anyone whatsoever. The "Hindu
> Terrorists" business, was not addressed to you, or to anyone in
> particular. On Shuddha's reprimand I had apologised for that, with a
> qualificatory explanation. I don't see why I must apologise again, and
> that too to you when I had never addressed you, only so that Pawan and
> you can then apologise for making libellous remarks against many on
> this list that they are "paid agents".
>
> I find it very curious that you should take that post, which just a
> news report, as an affront to yourself. Unless, of course, you are
> claiming to be offended as a Hindu. In which case: Are you more Hindu
> than I am? If yes, then on what basis? Caste?
>
>
>
> shivam
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 16, 2008 at 7:49 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul
> <kauladityaraj at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Thanks Monika for your e-mail. Though I don't understand what was the
> need
> > of this second mail; you had made things clear in the previous one. This
> > particular mail hasn't gone just too well of course. I humbly accept the
> > 'Code of Conduct' and seriously hope others would as well.
> >
> > But, in regard with the apology, I don't think only Pawan and I should
> fall
> > under this category. If you re-think and mention the following: 1)
> Shuddha
> > 2) Inder Salim 3) Shivam Vij 4) Aarti Sethi 5) Prakash Ray; atleast as
> well
> > to apologise, for provoking, instigating and maligning the two of us on
> > different occasions (just because we are Kashmiri Pandits and speak about
> > our community and the plight), hence forcing us to react. I'll follow and
> be
> > the first to apologise.
> >
> > 1) There has been 'name calling' on us. (Hindu Terrorists,
> Fundamentalists,
> > Extremists etc)
> > 2) People wanted to attempt 'sucide' if we openly discussed about this
> > particular community.
> > 3) We were even asked to 'shut up' more than once.
> > 4) Indirect filthy comments have become quite frequent now against us.
> > 5) 'Brain gone on a holiday' wasn't a descent way to answer.
> > 6) Attacks by a few individuals on our community, religion, Gods etc.
> >
> > I don't need to substantiate or provide any proof of the same, the list
> has
> > a well maintained archive, which can even easily be accessed through
> Google
> > Search. One may click and few buttons to understand things better.
> >
> > There is no 'ego' barrier for me to apologise. But 'what for ?' is my
> > question. Let the so called 'intellectuals' on this forum clean up their
> > language first, be a bit more patient, understanding and as well learn
> the
> > art of peaceful discussion, and academic argument.
> >
> > Hope the list admin. take note of this.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > On 11/16/08, Monica Narula <monica at sarai.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> Dear All,
> >>
> >> My mail as a list administrator has been understood in various ways.
> >> The most unfortunate reading has been one of seeing the whole episode
> >> as one of victimization of Kashmiri pandits in the list.  This is
> >> ridiculous. I cannot answer each bravado-filled mail...
> >>
> >> Lawrence's mail is very clear on one ground - there is a public life
> >> of the list outside its subscriber base. The safety of list-members
> >> (in as much as what they say and discuss on the platform but which is
> >> accessible to the whole world) is under threat because of accusations
> >> of a grave nature being loosely bandied about. This is all the more
> >> dangerous as the allegations are never substantiated and they act as
> >> repressors of speech and exchange. This fearful climate that is being
> >> generated through the list is something that is deeply disturbing.
> >>
> >> Keeping this context, I request Aditya and Pawan to apologize to list
> >> members against whom they have made numerous and un-substantiated
> >> accusations of dubious sources of funds. The apology needs to be made
> >> on the list so that the archive can have this as a record. This is
> >> serious and i hope all of you understand that in today's climes it is
> >> critical to maintain a sense of balance, ensure at least minimum
> >> safety for all list members, and keep alive the creative and
> >> investigative freedoms associated with this list.
> >>
> >>   From on, this list's public statement will have the following:
> >>
> >> "Code of Conduct for discussions on the list:
> >>
> >> 1) no person, whosoever they may be should make any allegations on
> >> the personal conduct of another list member or any other third
> >> person, without offering proof for the same. Should this proof be
> >> found  wanting, they should apologize.
> >>
> >> 2) that people voluntarily agree to refrain from making sexist and
> >> homophobic remarks or use racist language of any kind.
> >>
> >> On 3 infringement of these the person's list subscription will be
> >> terminated."
> >>
> >> I sincerely hope that this is clear and understandable to all.
> >>
> >> best
> >>
> >> Monica
> >>
> >> list admin
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Monica Narula
> >> Raqs
> >> Sarai-CSDS
> >> 29 Rajpur Road
> >> Delhi 110 054
> >> www.raqsmediacollective.net
> >> www.sarai.net
> >>
> >>
> >> _________________________________________
> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> >> Critiques & Collaborations
> >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
> >> subscribe in the subject header.
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> >> List archive: &lt;https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Aditya Raj Kaul
> >
> > Freelance Correspondent, The Times of India
> > Cell - +91-9873297834
> >
> > Campaign Blog: http://kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com/
> > Personal Blog: http://activistsdiary.blogspot.com/
> > _________________________________________
> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> > Critiques & Collaborations
> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
> subscribe in the subject header.
> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list
> > List archive: &lt;https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>
>
>
>
> --
>
> mail at shivamvij dot com
>

-- 
Aditya Raj Kaul

Freelance Correspondent, The Times of India
Cell - +91-9873297834

Campaign Blog: http://kashmiris-in-exile.blogspot.com/
Personal Blog: http://activistsdiary.blogspot.com/