[Reader-list] When was the first time you were told there is God?

[Pheeta Ram]

Let's work for a better world dear Murali. We don't seem to have enough
time.
Let's rush.

On Sat, Aug 1, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Murali V <murali.chalam at gmail.com> wrote:

> If some thing has made you laugh and feel happy, I am happy. That is my way
> of living.
>
> Regards,
> V Murali
>
> On Sat, Aug 1, 2009 at 11:00 AM, Pheeta Ram <pheeta.ram at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> "You make me laugh Murali," says Jahanvi. There is a bit of childish
>> rashness and irreverant matter-of-factness ( though
>> totally misplaced) the way you make an offer. The options are not
>> available like some commodity in our nearest shop, or Mall
>> if you will. There are many such experiments that are going on all over
>> the world. People have also set up "gated communities" and profess to be
>> citizens of another world that belongs to another day. Can you suggest me a
>> list of communities in India itself that are experimenting the way i have
>> suggested? What i would venture to suggest to you "personally" is to find
>> out the reasons why such communities are still segregated and away from the
>> public knowledge. Are they really communities that profess no faith, and if
>> they do not, what is the nature of their faith in the first place. We are
>> fortunate enough that people in so large a number are gracing this
>> discussion forum; one rarely gets such dedicated readers who also spend time
>> responding to fanatical proposals (and run for alarm at the slightest
>> provocation).
>>
>> With faith and religion are attached many other issues that have already
>> been debated in hallowed intellectual circles but their conclusions have not
>> been able to percolate down to the masses like us. The problems are as much
>> psychological as they are cultural. Take for example today's kewl college
>> going brats. They wear Che Guevara T-shrits and claim to belonging to no
>> religion live and act like hippies of 70s though fall far short of that
>> because of reasons too obvious to merit a mention. Now one might ask is this
>> the kind of "thing" that i am proposing. Certainly NOT! These guys don't
>> even know who Che was, somebody would as well tell you that he was a Harlem
>> pop star of the 60s or 20s if you will or just a "pop star." Moreover, they
>> would shoot a nearest temple at the first instance, whether for the sake of
>> girls or to crack an entrance test. I was shocked to see many kewl guys
>> fitted in branded jeans chanting Hanuman Chalisa when i dragged myself out
>> of curiosity to a temple in Delhi.
>>
>> Things run deep under kewl T-shirts!
>> We need to understand many such paradoxical webs, not individually
>> but "communally" through such a forum.
>> Best
>>
>>   On Sat, Aug 1, 2009 at 9:24 AM, Murali V <murali.chalam at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> What you propose is already available in a faith called "Way of Living".
>>> One has to attempt this philosophy and things would be for the good.
>>> Murali V
>>>
>>>   On Sat, Aug 1, 2009 at 2:35 AM, Pheeta Ram <pheeta.ram at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>>  Dear All,
>>>> I know this won't go down well with most of you but here it is:
>>>> Religions are the basic source of strife and as long as there will be
>>>> religions
>>>> (belief in this God and that) there will be such hostilities. By
>>>> professing
>>>> one religion
>>>> i simultaneously create an other being who, by inference, is either
>>>> follower
>>>> of some religion
>>>> or a pagan. The basic contradiction in all religions is that despite
>>>> their
>>>> moral-ethical discourse
>>>> regarding oneness of all humanity they are the principal segregators.
>>>> All
>>>> the saints who have
>>>> walked the earth deluded themselves with such fancies.
>>>>
>>>> Religion is not just a system of belief but also an economy. We depend a
>>>> lot
>>>> upon our religious capital
>>>> for our subsistance. A person who professes to be a member of certain
>>>> community (primarily religious)
>>>> also depends upon it as a kind of umbilical cord and draws sucour.
>>>>
>>>> By now earth has soaked so much blood because of religious strifes that
>>>> sometimes i wonder isn't it time
>>>> to abandon all religious badges and create a ethical moral code drawn
>>>> from
>>>> all the religions and start believing
>>>> in one community: that is Human.
>>>>
>>>> I think we need to believe in our brother next door and one walking on
>>>> the
>>>> street or the worker on a Metro site.
>>>> We need to believe that for the survival of humanity we need to believe
>>>> in
>>>> each other and not on some transcendental
>>>> agency. I wonder why we haven't learnt from our history. The primary
>>>> reason
>>>> why we have failed terribly in creating a
>>>> community of all human beings that walk the earth is because we are
>>>> afraid.
>>>> Afraid to believe in somebody who is in
>>>> front of us in flesh and blood. I remember a man sitting in Blue Line
>>>> who
>>>> was highly uncomfortable when a profusely sweating migrant labourer got
>>>> in
>>>> and found a seat, to his great relief, by his side. It is certain that
>>>> he
>>>> didn't know of the
>>>> religion of that worker but the stench of his sweat and his dirty
>>>> clothes
>>>> were enough for him to get up and keep standing
>>>> for the rest of his journey. I wonder when we have such intolerence for
>>>> a
>>>> 'fellow' human beings' honest sweat how would we
>>>> ever begin even thinking about such a Human community. The perils that
>>>> face
>>>> the earth now are reasons enough that we
>>>> start believing in each other and work for the future of humanity by
>>>> shunning all our sectarian tags. But strangely we are busy
>>>> inventing/refurbishing new messiah who would deliver us from the mess
>>>> that
>>>> we have ourselves created on this earth.
>>>>
>>>> I wonder what stops us from creating a new religion of Humanity.
>>>>
>>>> The advice that comes from scholarly circles regarding all this
>>>> religious
>>>> intolerance is : Tolerance!
>>>> That we need to tolerate each other. Tolerance is another form of
>>>> fascism or
>>>> nazism, what ever. I won't agree with substituting
>>>> the word toleracne with "respect" or "compassion". Why tolerate the very
>>>> root of strife in the first place.
>>>>
>>>> And yet, sadly, things are not as simple as that. But  a time comes when
>>>> we
>>>> have to call a spade a spade.
>>>> We have to shun God to love human beings. There is no other way. Just
>>>> visualize the situation: Two guys are standing in a big stadium in front
>>>> of
>>>> each other, just a metre apart but with their faces 'heaven'wards. Why
>>>> are
>>>> they afraid to see each other directly.
>>>> Why does the need arise to travel so many light years and then come to
>>>> ones
>>>> brother standing just a meter away.
>>>>
>>>> I know it is plain foolishness to ask somebody whose bread and butter
>>>> depends upon religion to shun it and enter the fold of Humanity where
>>>> people
>>>> believe in people and work with mutual responsibility. But we
>>>> need neo-believers who are foolish enough to
>>>> believe in such a possibility and are ready to work for it. It's a
>>>> long revolution but a possible one.
>>>>
>>>> But, the roadblocks are mighty hard to surpass. Take for instance my
>>>> case:
>>>> I have a primary school in my neighbourhood, a government one. And
>>>> every morning even before i have got up their assembly begins and the
>>>> chants
>>>> of sacred Hindu mantras begin. All this atma and parmatma stuff. Though
>>>> i
>>>> don't dispute the sense inherent in the prayer yet aren't we or rather
>>>> the
>>>> supposedly and proffessedly secular government entering into the
>>>> business
>>>> of 'mass conversion'. When i have all these religious prayers embedded
>>>> into
>>>> my consciousness right from my childhood can you imagine how much i
>>>> would
>>>> have to suffer to convert back to the religion of humanity if i convert
>>>> at
>>>> all and not turn into some religious fanatic. Less said of the schools
>>>> run
>>>> by one religion or the other the better.
>>>>
>>>> Though the proposal seems indecent yet i think there are madmen enough
>>>> to
>>>> believe in this long long revolution.
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>