[Reader-list] see some meaning in Yasin Malik's choice

[Partha Dasgupta]

Dear Aditya,

I must be repeating myself, but there are some questions I need to
reiterate:

1.  Is the purpose retribution of resolution?
        a)  If it is retriibution, then there will never be resolution
        b)  Where does it say that a person (man or woman) can't change
their mind

2.  If I follow a path, and then leave a cause as I loose belief in it, must
I always be branded with my first belief?
      Like any other human, have made mistakes and adjusted my beliefs, and
am sure you have too.

3.   Forget 'Gandhian' as he's a tough act to follow though I have seen my
elders talking about Gandi and JP. Where I am is a human with many a
fragility following what I can.

4.   The 'Law' and the 'regulators' are what we make and vote them as. If
they are at fault, so are we.

5.   Kashmir is what we consciously or unconsciously have made of it, and we
have to accept the current status and move forward on that.

That may be my naivete and I am willing to accept that. Are you willing to
accept status quo and move forward from there to a resolution.

Foolish questions from a father, but I'd rather have hope & life than death
and disappointment.

Rgds, Partha
......................

On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 5:46 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul <kauladityaraj at gmail.com>wrote:

> Dear Rakesh,
>
> From Wikepedia knowledge you have now yet again moved to another part known
> as the propaganda of 'English media'. I wonder how much Yasin Malik can
> even
> read to have gained such drastic transformation that he is now being called
> the modern 'Gandhian'. It is quite amusing as in younger days he was a
> street hooligan chasing girls and left schooling at a primary age, later he
> climbed the barbed wires of the border to get arms training along with a
> few
> hundred others to initiate a bloody killing spree in the peaceful valley of
> Kashmir. Not that he cannot gain such transition, but that would be a
> miracle in all ways if it at all is true.
>
> The first step on his part to peace and change would have been an open
> apology to the Kashmiri Pandits for killing their innocent members and
> followed by a surrender openly for his crimes. Now that, we haven't even
> seen an iota of such attitude we are pretty sure how fool-proof this
> political game of this so called changed man is. With a character
> make-over,
> help from his lobby in New Delhi, Islamabad, and some other world cities he
> has easily fooled common people. The Indian Government of course has been
> using him on and off; he is on direct pay rolls; otherwise he would have
> long been tried for his crimes and put behind bars. There are organisations
> like PUCL, Amnesty, Association of Disappeared Persons in Kashmir, and some
> puppets like Arundhati Roy, Gautam Navlakha and a prominent documentary
> film
> maker who is a member of this forum (Jashn-e-aazadi fame); who are being
> used as his messangers.
>
> I have relevant documents which say how many cases are pending against him
> across the valley; among them two important ones being handled by the CBI.
> Not just hundreds Kashmiri Pandits; but he has even killed four IAF men
> openly exact 20 years ago.
>
> I think even you should try to reach the J&K High Courts and see for
> yourself how difficult is it to carry on with the legal work. Not that it
> is
> corrupt and a tedious exercise; but other reasons which you should
> understand without mention. Otherwise with so many media reports in the
> early days the Court could have easily taken a suo-motto Notice of his
> barbaric crimes against humanity. It is unfortunate that even the Supreme
> Court is silent on him and the exodus of Kashmiri Hindus; whereas it spoke
> quite blunt on the Gujarat much hyped riots.
>
> I'll certainly inform you if at all there is progress in any of the cases.
> Till then it goes just like a popular hindi movie dialog, "Tareekh pe
> Tareekh".
>
> No Indian Courts, No International NGOs, No Human Rights Bodies, No NHRC,
> No
> Liberal & Secular Social Activists, Writers and lastly No Government has
> tried to care for our plight. They have all remained silent for last 20
> years; many retarded people now even claim that the most unfortunate forced
> Pandit exodus at the hands of Islamic 'Revolutionaries' was actually a
> economic migration. This is what we have come to. Is there anything I can
> reply to this mindless claim ?
>
> Tell me:
>
> Why can't we demand for JUSTICE when everybody is turning a blind eye to us
> ?
>
> Why can't we protest against psychopath killers like Yasin Malik, Bitta
> Karate and demand a death penalty for them ?
>
> Why is it that some people get so uncomfortable with our constant protests,
> awareness campaigns, and articles which speak nothing but truth ?
>
> You suggest that we should return to those clusters which the Govt.
> intended
> to build for us in some corners of Kashmir. Do you think we are some
> temporary work force which should be accomodated somewhere in the corner
> and
> things move on, on their own thereafter ? Its stupidity to make such
> clusters in the first place, which was initiated by Mufti Sayeed and now is
> being opposed by Omar's NC.
>
> Its unfortunate that mention of  'Kashmiri Pandits' is mere token in
> Government dealings, packages, policies or any other economic plans. Our
> viewpoint, suggestions and political demands are ignored.
>
> It was in a survey of a prominent english news channel where it was wrongly
> stated that Kashmiris want 'Aazadi'. This exact survey was studied by
> analyists who had no bias and it all porved to be a big mess up. The entire
> survey sample and the connotation was wrong. Again google might be of help
> to you. Or even Reader's List archives which had a long debate on it.
>
> As I said before 'Aazadi' term has now just become subjected to the rooms
> of
> Hurriyat and JKLF. The common people believe in the Indian Democracy and it
> is these heroes of Hate such as Yasin Malik, Shabir Shah, Syed Ali Shah
> Geelani etc. who time and again brainwash people which result in loss of
> innocents. The freedom given to these leaders needs to be curbed for free
> flow of democracy in the valley. These leaders are actually 'Mohalla & Gali
> leaders' who do not have a base or a framework of mind towards development
> and progress. They have their singular personal motives for which they work
> and carry on with their shops.
>
> There is not a breakdown of trust between Kashmiri Pandits and Muslims who
> are now based in the valley. But actually, Kashmiri Pandits don't trust
> most
> of them as they remained mute spectators to our exodus. Omar Abdullah the
> J&K Chief Minister recently confessed to this in front of media. I don't
> think I need to say more. The reversal of the process of ethnic cleansing
> is
> the only first step towards peace and reconciliation.
>
> Panun Kashmir is a political demand, which will exist how so ever you may
> disagree or agree with it. It is the only way to ensure our safety, secure
> our shrines and property and it is secular in character. Not like so called
> 'Aazadi' which is based on Religious lines. No such demand as such of
> 'Aazadi' is acceptable to any sane human being which has put its base on
> the
> blood of the minority Hindu Community of the valley which gave the world
> well-known teachers, politicians, scientists, scholars etc.
>
> For again your kind information, early last year we had put ahead a step to
> have talks with your pet Hurriyat. But its chairman Mirwaiz out rightly
> rejected it. You have google and our campaign blog to see how it was
> reported in media and what led to this consequence. We tried our bit, and
> saw in how much murky waters things are in reality.
>
> We even have efforts on the ground level here. We have many 'Kashmiri
> Muslim' friends who support us and openly campaign against Islamic
> Terrorist
> Yasin Malik. What problems do others have ?
>
> 'Aazadi' is now a thing of the past, that too if at all it ever existed. I
> don't have any comments for it further.
>
> Kashmiri Pandits will never forgive terrorist Yasin Malik; lets be straight
> on it. We'll continue to campaign under law for his arrest and conviction.
> There is lot to happen my friend.. As I said bookish and wikipedia things
> are easy to say and it looks good in theory and again whatever Media says
> or
> propagates isn't true. Lot happens behind the curtains..
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
> On 2/5/09, Rakesh Iyer <rakesh.rnbdj at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Dear Aditya
> >
> > Your reply has raised certain questions and points in my mind, which I
> wish
> > to express further.
> >
> > For your kind information, in Wikipedia, there is no such information as
> > Yasin Malik saying that he read Gandhi's works to become 'non-violent'. I
> do
> > agree that there are people like this who initially commit acts of
> violence,
> > and then say that they have read something which has made them
> non-violent.
> > However, the fact remains that if we go in the history of what happened
> in
> > Kashmir since 1990, once insurgency started, it was Yasin Malik who was
> the
> > first person to agree to talks with the Indian Union to get 'azadi' for
> > Kashmir. And this is not the information from Wikipedia. This is
> something I
> > have managed to get thanks to an important lecture I attended a few days
> > ago, organized by PUCL, Tamil Nadu unit.
> >
> > Second. I have also read that Yasin Malik is infact a double agent of
> both
> > the Indian and the Pakistani establishments, and he serves the purpose of
> > both to embarass each other. Some actions have also been pointed out to
> this
> > effect, where he has embarassed both Indian and Pakistani establishments
> in
> > different actions. However, the way the statements have been put up is
> just
> > casting aspersions on Malik itself. If there are facts pertaining to the
> > fact that Malik indeed has contacts which he has been using, then they
> must
> > be brought out in public. For after all, as law says, to prove any
> > statement, the proof must be 'proof beyond doubt' to satisfy the case.
> > Hence, the allegation against Malik that he is a 'stooge' of the Indian
> > government, remains just that, a mere allegation, with nothing to
> > substantiate it. As for the cases against Malik, let them be proved in
> > court. And you could inform me if you can, about the progress in these
> > cases.
> >
> > Third. When I talked about Singur, Gujarat and even say tribals, I was
> > talking about the people who were actually facing the problem, not the
> NGO's
> > or others at all. I accept that these people got great support from the
> > NGO's and others, but the fact remains that in all these cases, these
> very
> > people have also suffered a lot, and still they themselves didn't make as
> > much noise as has been portrayed in media. Infact, each became famous
> thanks
> > to incidents and entry of people who were famous. Singur became famous
> more
> > so once Trinamool Congress entered the fray agitating for the local
> people.
> > Gujarat became famous because of NGO's and English media entering in to
> > cover the riots live (the local Gujarati media was involved in biased
> > reporting, that too made it famous). And tribals have not managed to gain
> > the attention of the media, because important political formations and/or
> > the upper elites of society have not involved themselves in the struggle
> of
> > the tribals.
> >
> > What I basically wanted to say was that, the Pandits have yes, been
> > fighting for the cause of justice for the past 19-20 years. And yes, they
> > may not have received any support from the NGO's or the government. But
> does
> > that mean, that you can go on asking for retribution in the name of
> justice?
> > And more importantly, if the govt. of India is willing to provide them
> > houses in the Valley itself, why is it so that Pandits are not willing to
> > return at all?
> >
> > Let me clearly state here. There has been a complete breakdown of trust
> > between the Pandits and the Kashmiri Muslims. The incidents of 1990,
> > whichever way one looks at it, has resulted in disastrous consequences of
> > today. On one hand, Kashmiri Pandits have still not been able to return
> back
> > to their homeland. On the other, Kashmiri Muslims have been subjected to
> > living under an 'army state' where all freedoms have been clamped down
> on,
> > which is against the very notion of 'democracy'. And for me, both are
> wrong.
> >
> >
> > And the solution of Panun Kashmir, which you as a community have
> > proposed(not all may be, but certainly some have put up this solution),
> is
> > not the solution because it won't be backed by the Muslims living in the
> > Valley, though I am not against putting it up for referendum. Similarly,
> the
> > rights of minorities must be protected, and therefore the rights of
> Pandits
> > to their homeland must be accepted. Therefore, the important thing is not
> > only to ask for justice, but also in some sense, forgive people by not at
> > least asking for death sentences by the Pandits on one hand, and by
> > surrendering arms and voluntarily facing cases on the part of Kashmiri
> > Muslims on the other (here I refer to those who took up arms, not those
> who
> > didn' t do so).
> >
> > Secondly, there has to be a dialogue between both the communities to
> build
> > trust for each other. That should be the path ahead for the return of
> > Pandits.
> >
> > As I see it, I dont' see either of the steps having been taken uptill
> now.
> > Can you at least, being one of the speakers for the Kashmiri Pandits (one
> of
> > the many speakers, actually) tell whether you made efforts for the same?
> For
> > after all, not all Muslims living in your very homeland area can be
> > 'traitors'. And as you yourself accept, they are human beings.
> >
> > I haven't called you pseudos. What I say is that there's a limit to going
> > around portraying yourself as a victim, to justify any action of yours.
> >
> > And finally one more thing. It has been time and again said that
> democratic
> > elections in J&K are not the substitute for the dominant feeling of
> 'azadi',
> > and the people there, majority of them want 'azadi', with or without
> > Hurriyat. Since you (and I think many in rest of India) feel that this is
> > not the case, I think that the Indian Union should better conduct a
> > referendum in the Valley and make the results public to find out whether
> > people really want azadi or not. If they want it, then better give it. If
> > they don't want it, you can burn declare public holidays commemorating
> the
> > same occasion, and can also burn my effigies. I have no problems for that
> > effect.
> >
> > The reason why I ask for the referendum is this. If I am true, I know I
> > will always win no matter how much someone conspires against me. Then why
> > not let the truth win once again, if you believe (and so many in rest of
> > India believe) that your side is true. Go ahead, and do it.
> >
> > And while I have no pain at all with Kashmiri Pandits raising their voice
> > against the Indian Govt, what I have pain with is that the Pandits feel
> that
> > only they are democratic, whereas the 'azadi struggle' is undemocratic.
> > Infact, Kashmiris are now being painted by the brush of terrorism and
> being
> > Pakistanis, whereby it is being stated that Kashmiris want to be
> Pakistanis.
> > The fact is that as numerous surveys and interviews of common people
> bring
> > out, they want to be independent of both India and Pakistanis. And more
> > importantly, even in an azad Kashmir, I believe that Pandits deserve to
> have
> > a place there. And therefore, I am not in favor of any independent state
> > till any resolution of the place of Pandits in this new state and the
> local
> > society is found.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Rakesh
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
>
> --
> Aditya Raj Kaul
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-- 
Partha Dasgupta
+919811047132