[Reader-list] The Islamic Flag of Indian Muslims

Thu May 7 19:39:48 IST 2009

Dear Kshmendra
I am not advocate, so cant follow the point endlessly,
these are inferences from your previous mails Still, all marks to
those who detest Modi for his role in Gujarat Riots. and i guess you
are one of them.

i quote you again

A question I have (asked on this List too) "What does sending Modi
back into office say about the people of Gujarat? Why did they do
it?". I believe the answer to that question of importance. No one
cares to address that. I do not have the intelligence/knowledge to do
it. Damning Modi is easily done but that does not answer the question.

Now dear Kshmendra, i see it as an answer itself, because if people of
Gujarat bring Modi back again to power exonerates him from the crimes
committed during . this is level one.

the other level is  that people voting a particular person does not
mean that she/he is clean.

Mrs. Indira Gandhi never deserved to become Prime Minister of India,
in the first place, but people voted her to power, and when time
arrived, she commited crimes never seen before, she imposed emergency,
encouraged corruption and gave birth to first terrorist movement in
India in Punjab.

so Modi and people of Gujarat are not one, they are two, always, even
now when people vote him,
there are voices that if PM canditate was Modi instead of Advani  BHP
might increase its tally of seats by 25-30 ,

but unfortunately for BJP Advani is still around so they may have to
sit in the opposition yet again,
now how to think about that ?

with love and regards
is

On Thu, May 7, 2009 at 4:05 PM, Kshmendra Kaul <kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Dear Inder
>
> Thank you for responding.
>
> Now please tell me what is there in my writing which you have so kindly
> reproduced that led your telling me that I had " ... instantly clubbed
> development of Gujarat with Modi."
>
> On the contrary I had expressed (in my mail to Jeebesh) agreement with the
> following words of  Tridip Suhrd:
>
> """"" If evil ever pretended to be good in the guise of  development, Sanjay
> and Modi are the siblings of modernity that we can  do without. """"""
> Is there any ambiguity in these words with which I agreed.
>
> Dear Inder, I have had this problem with you in the past also, and I had
> repeatedly requested you then and I am again requesting you ...... please do
> not attribute to me what I have not said.
>
> Kshmendra
>
> --- On Wed, 5/6/09, Inder Salim <indersalim at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: Inder Salim <indersalim at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The Islamic Flag of Indian Muslims
> To: "reader-list" <reader-list at sarai.net>
> Date: Wednesday, May 6, 2009, 5:05 PM
>
> Kshmenda to Jeebesh :
>
> That is the reason why I find too starkly prejudicial TS's statement
> about Modi """" Here is a man incapable of care and
> nurturance
> reincarnating himself in, and as, an  act of violence.""""
>
> No one is incapable of 'care and nurturance'. No one is evil
> incarnate. Such monsterisation is as ill-advised as deification. It
> serves as an easy answer but is far from any completeness of
> understanding of a person.
>
> Such a statement is also disrespectful and dismissive about Gujarat
> and it's people who TS identifies so closely with as is evident in the
> essay  "In Defeat, Let Us Reclaim Our Selves" (Essay 2)
>
> A question I have (asked on this List too) "What does sending Modi
> back into office say about the people of Gujarat? Why did they do
> it?". I believe the answer to that question of importance. No one
> cares to address that. I do not have the intelligence/knowledge to do
> it. Damning Modi is easily done but that does not answer the question.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 6, 2009 at 4:16 PM, Kshmendra Kaul <kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> Dear Inder
>>
>> Request you to answer a simple question before I address the other points
> in
>> your mail. Please do honour this request.
>>
>> Where have I (as put by you)
>>
>>  """""instantly clubbed development of Gujarat
> with Modi.""""""
>>
>> Will be grateful for your response evidencing that statement attributed to
>> me.
>>
>> Not even in my dreams would I find any excuse (including any economic
>> development) that would justify or make bearable the person of Modi for
> me.
>>
>> Kshmendra
>>
>>
>>
>> --- On Wed, 5/6/09, Inder Salim <indersalim at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> From: Inder Salim <indersalim at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The Islamic Flag of Indian Muslims
>> To: "reader-list" <reader-list at sarai.net>
>> Date: Wednesday, May 6, 2009, 12:07 AM
>>
>> Dear Kshmendra,
>> I am not using this an opportunity to point out this fact, but it
>> struck me earlier as well..... when you instantly clubbed development
>> of Gujarat with Modi.
>>
>> I  agree that ‘evil’ cant be visualized just in the face of one
>> bearded man,........... but we must not forget how  Germany progressed
>> under HItler as well.  So what is Development? Imagine if the boys who
>> killed Aman Kachroo were toppers, would you forgive them?
>>
>> I guess no.   We have to ask many questions to ourselves, before we
>> ask others. here muslims, poor muslims .who never voted for Partition,
>> never knew even about what it was all aboutt, and never know even why
>> they are called pakistanis here in India, and never even know why they
>> are sometimes unwittingly following a green colour with crecent and
>> star, never know even that it has nothing to do with Islam.......
>>
>> The issue of Flag and Indian Muslims is as old one. We all know, how
>> Kashmiris wittingly  vent their anger against Indian occupation by
>> identifying themselves with this flag.  It has all to do with
>> partition related pending issues.... whether u like it not, Pakistan
>> is a reality, even during the current crises. And pakistan is not only
>> green, crescent and star , but something more like India is not
>> tricolour only
>>
>> It is here, your intellect falls on banana  peels, because you have
>> zero tolerance against something called Nation State.
>>
>> you feel, nothing should rip this sacred word, not even at the level
>> of rhetoric...not even if Plague like thing fills the air we breath.
>>
>> i am Indian , but I dont  know who qualifies as a true Indian in the
>> first place.......where are those translations which we can store in a
>> locker room, and exhibit as tags on our foreheads to describe our
>> loyaty to the Nation as and when a so called Hindu Indian demands from
>> us... why so
>>
>> Meanwhile, like Narender Modi i too think you have a brilliant mind, a
>> talent to grasp the content of mails  quickly and reflect back with
>> speed, but alas, .......
>>
>>
>> with love and regards
>> inder salim
>>
>> I quote Kshmendra from you other brilliant response to Jebeesh forward
>> of Tridip Suhrud
>>
>> A hundred years from today will anyone other than Gandhi (MK) belong
>> to history? I see no one who will be anything more than italicised
>> footnotes in very small print.
>>
>> again, Mr. Kshmendra, u are wrong, which does not mean that i am right
>>
>> is
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:19 PM, Kshmendra Kaul
> <kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> QUOTE:
>>>
>>> It also carried drawings of two white and black flags, the former
> being
>> the main flag of Holy Prophet Muhammad (Peace be Upon Him) and the latter
>> his
>> military standard. Even now, black-turbaned TNSM members carry the small
>> white
>> and black flags as they walk ahead of Sufi Mohammad. ...... UNQUOTE
>>>
>>> This quote is from an article on Maulana Sufi Mohammad written by
>> Rahimullah Yusufzai.
>>> http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=175825
>>>
>>> No green flag. No crescent and star on it.
>>>
>>> The green flag with the crescent and star on it which is used by
> Indian
>> Muslims has often caused misunderstandings.
>>>
>>> One recent example has been Simi Garewal talking about Pakistani Flags
>> being flown by Indian Muslims. She apologised later for having mistaken
> the
>> Islamic Flag of the Indian Muslims for the Pakistani Flag.
>>>
>>> The close resemblance between the 2 flags confused even
>> Anupam Chakravartty, who inspite of video coverage from Times Now showing
> it
>> to
>> be a Pakistani Flag, insisted that what was flown in Assam with "
> sickle
>> (sic) and star on green background  is an islamic symbol"
>>> http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2009-April/018755.html
>>>
>>> In an earlier mail I had commented:
>>>
>>> """""" If this is factual, then the
> question
>> arises for the Indian Muslims that should they be thinking about using the
>> Islamic Flag without the Crescent and Star so that it does not appear to
> be
>> close to being the flag of Pakistan? """"""
>>> http://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/2008-December/017016.html
>>>
>>> Just thinking aloud
>>>
>>> Kshmendra
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
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