[Reader-list] Fw: Re: Why Kashmir defies solutions

Tue Sep 7 19:21:26 IST 2010

The so called iron frame of indian bureaucracy is produced by ICS  
officers. It was more than getting on with life :)

On Kashmir i understand very little to be able to comment. But some  
comments seem to mock the people who are trying to articulate  
something substantial. A little caution   about interpreting quickly.  
The maxim of the actors are always far more complicated and illegible  
than the judgement of the spectator.

On 07-Sep-10, at 6:32 PM, SJabbar wrote:

> Did they?  Or did they do what most people do, make their peace with  
> the new
> dispensation and get on with life.
>
> The point is to understand how it is that a phenomena like 60,000  
> young men
> applying for 3,000 jobs can happen in the midst of what people are
> describing as a revolution. Can it be that they don't see the J&K  
> Police as
> an abhorrent force?  Can it be that they are the relatives of men  
> who are
> already in the JKP?  Can it be that they don't subscribe to azadi?  
> And how
> do the families of tens of thousands of men who are in the JKP and  
> JAKLI see
> their kin?
>
> Another puzzling matter:  we speak of the AFSPA and its revocation  
> but the
> JKP is not protected by the Act.  And one more thing: the army, that  
> has
> been responsible for the worst human rights abuses in the last 2  
> decades is
> not targeted by the stone-pelters.  They continue their work of  
> patrolling
> and cordon & search operations as if they live on another planet.  
> The target
> is always the JKP.
>
>
> On 07/09/10 6:06 PM, "Jeebesh" <jeebesh at sarai.net> wrote:
>
>> agreed. but how come they all became unquestionable nationalists  
>> after
>>
> 1947?
>
> On 07-Sep-10, at 5:41 PM, SJabbar wrote:
>
>> You're right Jeebesh, and
>> most people who were recruited were
>> absolutely
>> loyal to the British
>> Empire and deeply suspicious of the Congress.
>> And why
>> just speak of the
>> 20th c. ? In 1857 the country was deeply divided
>> and very
>> few at the
>> time articulated it as a 'war for independence.'  It
>> would be
>> foolish to
>> say that those who served the British Empire were closet
>> nationalists forced
>> into furthering their careers by joining the
>> army or
>> ICS.
>>
>>
>> On
>> 07/09/10 5:22 PM, "Jeebesh" <jeebesh at sarai.net> wrote:
>>
>>> recruitment in
>> indian subcontinent during the ww1 and ww2 for jobs in
>> the
>>> british army
>> was very high. what did this say about the aspiration
>> and lives
>>> being led
>> at that time in the sub continent. do we even
>> count that number
>>> today in
>> discussing 20s, 30s, 40s, in the sub
>> continent?
>>
>> On 07-Sep-10, at
>>> 2:10
>> PM, SJabbar wrote:
>>
>>> But Gowhar, what happens when a man who hitherto
>>>
>> abhors an
>>> institution joins
>>> it? What happens to that extreme emotion
>>>
>> when the line is crossed,
>>> when the
>>> uniform is donned, when the
>> 'danda'
>>> drops firmly into his hands?
>>> By your logic all those who joined
>> the force
>>> post-1990 once abhorred
>>> the
>>> institution and now have become
>> the
>>> oppressors.  And those who pelt
>>> stones
>>> at the oppressors now want
>> to
>>> join the same hated institution only
>>> to become
>>> future oppressors?
>> Not
>>> one, not two but 60,000 young men?  You may
>>> understand this, but I
>> have to
>>> tell you, it's left me totally
>>> perplexed.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 07/09/10
>> 1:58 PM,
>>> "gowhar fazli" <gowharfazili at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I don't
>> like the heading
>>> "Why Kashmir
>>>> defies solutions".
>>>>
>>>> It is in
>>>>>
>> these moments that the
>>> real desperation and loss
>>>> of self of Kashmiris
>> as a
>>>>> people becomes
>>> evident. For
>>>> livelihood they have to stoop
>> before the same
>>>>>
>>> institutions
>>>> that torment them or that they abhor
>> for obvious
>>> reasons.
>>>>
>>>>> This contradiction that runs through their
>> very selves,
>>>>
>>> prevents people
>>>>> from acquiring a full blown
>> human-hood.
>>>>
>>>> There should
>>> be no guilt or
>>>>> indignity associated
>> with
>>>> acquiring of livelihood
>>> through legitimate means,
>>>>> but
>> this
>>>> is the case one way or the other,
>>> for most people in
>>>>
>> Kashmir.
>>>>> The boundaries between legitimate and
>>> illegitimate
>>>> are
>> dizzyingly fuzzy
>>>>> because of the manner in which the
>>>>
>>> selves are
>> split.
>>>>
>>>> If not for any
>>>>> other but for the indignities
>>> involved
>> in
>>>> the status quo that Kashmir issue
>>>>> should be resolved for
>>>>
>>>
>> good.
>>>>
>>>> --- On Tue, 9/7/10, SJabbar
>>>>> <sonia.jabbar at gmail.com>
>>>>
>>>
>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> From: SJabbar
>>>>> <sonia.jabbar at gmail.com>
>>>>> Subject:
>>>
>> [Reader-list] Why Kashmir defies
>>>>> solutions
>>>>> To: "Sarai"
>>>
>> <reader-list at sarai.net>
>>>>> Date: Tuesday,
>>>>> September 7, 2010, 10:19
>> AM
>>>>>
>>> Printed from
>>>>>
>>>>> Khaki enemy? 60,000
>>>>> Kashmiris apply for
>> 3,000
>>> police
>>>> jobs
>>>>> M Saleem Pandit, TNN, Sep 7,
>>>>> 2010, 01.30am
>> IST
>>>>>
>>> SRINAGAR: Despite reports of desertions in its ranks
>>>>
>>>>>
>> and
>>>>> threats of
>>> social
>>>>> boycott, J&K police has emerged as a big
>> draw
>>>>> for
>>>> young
>>>>>
>>> job hunters in
>>>>> employment-starved
>> Kashmir. Ignoring calls
>>>>> by
>>>>
>>> hardliners to
>>>>> shun the khaki
>>>>>
>> force, nearly 60,000 men applied
>>>>> for
>>> less than 3,000
>>>> jobs
>>>>> in
>> J&K police --
>>>>> about 200 applicants for
>>>>>
>>> one constable's
>> post.
>>>>>
>>>>> The applications piled up over the last few
>>>>>
>>>
>> months,
>>>> about
>>>>> the time when the
>>>>> situation in the Valley
>> appeared
>>> to
>>>>> be spinning out
>>>> of
>>>>> control with the cops
>>>>>
>> particularly being
>>> at the
>>>>> receiving end of public
>>>> wrath.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> J&K police DG Kuldeep
>>> Khoda said
>>>>> the department
>>>> has
>>>>> received
>> 58,975
>>>>> applications,
>>> against 2,786
>>>>> vacancies across the
>>>>
>> Valley.
>>>>> "The response from
>>>>>
>>> (the worst-hit)
>>>>> Srinagar and
>> Budgam districts was even
>>>> more
>>>>>
>>> heartening," he
>>>>> said.
>>>>>
>> "We've received 2,860 applications, against
>>> 529
>>>> posts
>>>>> in
>> Srinagar
>>>>>
>>>>> district, while 8053 against 283 in
>>> Budgam," he
>> said.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lack of jobs
>>>>> has been a big spur for the
>>> protests
>>>>
>> that
>>>>> brought thousands of
>>>>>
>>>>> young educated men on to the
>>>
>> streets. Official
>>>> estimates of
>>>>> the number
>>>>> of
>>>>> unemployed in
>> the
>>> Valley stands at 3 lakhs.
>>>>>
>>>>> Khoda told
>>>>> reporters the
>> department held
>>> a
>>>> recruitment
>>>>> rally in Baramulla
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> district in July and was
>>> overwhelmed with the
>>>> response.
>>>>> "Over
>> 8,000
>>>>> people
>>>>> turned up for
>>> 412 posts despite turmoil in the
>>>>
>> district,"
>>>>> he
>>>>> said, and added
>>>>>
>>> that even stone-pelters
>> attended the rally. He said
>>>>
>>>>> the
>>>>> department
>>> was
>>>>> mulling
>> more on-the-spot recruitment drives
>>>>> across
>>>> the
>>>>>
>>> Valley,
>> particularly
>>>>> in Srinagar's downtown area to end
>>>>> the
>>>
>> unrest.
>>>>>
>>>>> The top cop rubbished reports on desertions and
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>> insubordination. He claimed
>>>>> no police personnel had quit since
>>>
>> mid-June
>>>>> when
>>>> Kashmir
>>>>> erupted in anger
>>>>> against the
>> alleged
>>> staged encounter
>>>>> of three north
>>>> Kashmir
>>>>> youth and
>> a
>>>>> 17-year-old
>>> boy's killing in
>>>>> police action. Over 60
>>>>
>> people,
>>>>> including women
>>>>>
>>> and children, have
>>>>> died in police
>> firing on
>>>> protesters
>>>>> since
>>> then.
>>>>>
>>>>> State
>>>>> government
>> sources said J&K CM Omar
>>>> Abdullah,
>>> who
>>>>> has called for a
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> proactive approach including the phased
>>> revocation of
>>>> the
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> controversial
>>>>> Armed Forces Special Forces Act
>>> to deal with
>> street
>>>>>
>>>>> protests, has ordered
>>>>> creation of more police
>>> jobs to
>> induct youth from
>>>>> the
>>>>> troubled areas.
>>>>>
>>>>> Meanwhile, in
>>> its
>> ongoing drive to reach out
>>>>> to the
>>>> people,
>>>>> Kashmir range
>>>>>
>> IGP
>>> Kashmir, S M Sahai, attended
>>>>> police-public
>>>> meetings in
>>>>>
>> Ganderbal
>>> and
>>>>> Budgam districts. "At
>>>>> Ganderbal District Police
>>>>
>> Lines,
>>>>>
>>> around 300 people
>>>>> including senior
>>>>> citizens and
>> sarpanchs
>>> participated,"
>>>> a
>>>>> police spokesman
>>>>> said.
>>>>> "Sahai
>> assured the
>>> people that police will
>>>> adopt
>>>>> maximum
>> restraint
>>>>>
>>>>> while dealing
>>> with law and order
>> situations."
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>> _________________________________________
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