[Reader-list] FW: FW: Guests in Vedavati's house

Tue Nov 6 18:35:31 IST 2007

dear Vedavati
Strictly speaking, i am not replying ur mails  but i am reacting to
what is already out there.... your mails are not  giving birth to my
securlar thoughts, but i believe, that our society is really trying to
get rid of unnecessary tags.... The people want to be free, but people
like you are more worried about the fate of Brahmins, and their
counterpart in other religions. In that sense there is no differnece
between a Mullah and a Brahmin which you are hell bent to hightlight
as lipstick on the face of modern India. Personally, I am truly trying
to be secular.  Here, i dont think you should have any problems.

Gandhi was also trying to be secular, we all have right to judge him
in our own personal capacity. He had done his bit, inspite of the fact
that many people were uncomfortable. Both, merits and demerit of
Gandhi's secular thought were meant to evolve but we unfortunately go
back to vulgar past and identify it as Hinduism.  For example, Gandhi
was quite stupid when he suggested to cover the Khajuraho temple
reliefs with cement or whatever.....He had no understanding of
sexuality and that is why, perhaps he had ......

If you are a woman, please try to see  the rigid and frigid Male in a
Religion. The dignity of an individual is paramount. I guess if we
quickly finish with this business of Gods then we might give some
attention to enviromental issues. Just see the reason why air and
sound pollution is a very very small issue on the eve of Deepavali.
People are busy marketing the Ganeshas and Laxmis on gifts and
commodities. Imagine Laxmi on a Rocket, Patakha or Annar. If you realy
love Laxmi, you should feel ofended when Laxmi image is blasted by
Hindus in the name of Deepawali. If you have no problems, why do you
have with MF Hussain's art.  Is not this biased.?

When Parvez Musharaf said  " Please dont expect the level of Democracy
from us...  He was also talking about the impossiblity of secularism
in Pakistan, and which is not the fact.  See, who is the beneficiary
of Emergency in Pakistan. Just the Army and the elite.  So if we curse
the imposition of Martial Law in Pakistan, we also should curse
something which is not in the interest of People in India. RSS is one
such thing which we dont need, simply because it has no understanding
of an individual on the basis of simple needs in life and nature.  The
only face it wants to see is: Hindu face of the individual,  and
therefore,  it looks similar to Nazis.  The same can be applied to
Jamat-i-islami and other derivatives of such organizations. I agree,
that the true level of democray is still a mirage in the west even,
but they too are trying, so should we too...

Here, you can easily label me as a communist. I dont have problems
with the word but that too has become a passe, and we better move to a
better future.  What is in the name, so please come forward and give
space to this democratic rose to sperad its fragrance of love and
peace.

Lastly, how you find it so easy to represent  Kashmiri Pandits every
time and mix it with whatever .... Do you know why Kasmirii Pandit
communtiy employees were not allowed to join the offices in Jammu
after migration becaue the Hindu Dogra popularion asserted its
regional identity.  They still conitue to be the outsiders in  Hindu
Jammu city.  I am not complaining  about that, but what i want to say
is that there is not Hindu which fits in a single word ' HINDU' and
that applies to Muslims too.

Why i am writing this in detail, is because that i strongly feel that
it is only our recent past which has given birth to this Hindu Muslim
divide, and therefore, we  urgently need to enter the maze of it with
all sincerity and find common links which are so numerous that this
'divide' naturally sccumbs inwardly because of many inherent
contradictions.

with love and regards
inder salim

On 11/5/07, Vedavati Jogi <vrjogi at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> hello,
>
> thanks for reading my mails for a long time. i don't know other's reactions because i don't receive r-list mails. i am sure they must not be different from what you have written.
>
> firstly i write things based on facts, if you find them rant its your opinion. if you don't understand/ see the things which are as bright as day its again your problem.
>
> i have to repeat myself because i find same secular lies again & again on r-list.
> when people like yogi sikand, shuddha, roger das , and many more keep talking about descrimination and problems faced by muslims in india, you don't get annoyed, when they keep cursing rss, vhp, modi again & again, you don't get provoked, but when i try to counter them that inspires you to write mail, surprising!
>
> r-list does not block mails by thses people mentioned above when they spread hatred towards rss & likes, but when i try to expose psudo secularists my mails are blocked.
> this type of psudosecularism was propagated in 20th century in gandhian era, which ultimately resulted into partition of this country. kashmiri hindus have become refugees in their own country again because of this psudo secularism - shame on us, that we have still not learnt any lesson.
>
> after 2006 news had appeared in indian express that terrorists wanted to make blasts in gujrat but local muslims did not 'dare' to support them hence ultimately terrorists chose mumbai. it speaks volumes.
> i hope you understand what i mean. i have never never supported gujrat riots in 2002. but one must try to understand psychology of hindus. they too have right to defend themselves, they too have right to take revenge.
>
> vedavati
>
>
> Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 15:42:29 +0000From: anu.mukh at gmail.comTo: vrjogi at hotmail.comSubject: Re: [Reader-list] FW: FW: Guests in Vedavati's house
> Dear Vedavati,
>
> I have been reading your posts for a long time. Without going into their merits or demerits, they seriously need to be structured better in order to say what you want to convey. Otherwise it is simply a rant. Rants are also valid, but this may not be the best forum for that. I suggest, start a blog. And may I also add that you don't ever say anything new. Not a new line of thought or even facts. You just go on repeating yourself.
>
> I have been a most invisible reader here, but you inspired me to write in. Continue the good work, but do at least make an effort to make what you write readable and therefore more easy to understand. Your scorn for "pseudo-secularists" is well-known, but since many of them are your readers, at least be legible. But I also find it funny that words like intellectual and pseudo-secularists are tossed about with such ease without even sparing a thought about their meaning or genesis. Almost every totalitarian regime or mindset that wanted to attack free-thinking has used such terms regardless which side of the fence they were on.
>
> The earth-shattering questions you ask can all be answered. But only somebody with immense patience can do it, take up your arguments point-wise and shred them. May be it is high time somebody should. But then what's the point, you don't ever listen to others, do you? Frankly, for most of us, it's not worth the effort. I agree with Inder when he says that you need to shape your debate better. Before you lump me with him and declare us a part of some "pseudo-secularist agenda" let me add that I may or may not agree with him on other things.
> Best
> Anuradha
>
>
>   1/red need3/07, Vedavati Jogi <vrjogi at hotmail.com> wrote:
> lot must have been discussed by readers list members about tehelka, as i am not receiving any mail from r-list  i don't have the priviledge to read the secular thoughts. i want to express my views which may or may not be published by r-list. i feel if tehelka is so much fond of digging the past things, i can suggest few more subjects. 1) for thousands of years muslimss killed/ looted/ converted hindus, pulled down their temples, humiliated their women. tehelka can study & find out how many of muslims in india are originally hindus. how many mandirs have been dismantled & converted into masjids. 2) why was india partitioned in 1947? inspite of gandhi's appeasement policy, why was jinnah & his followers remained so adamant? what was meant by 'has ke liya pakistan, ladh ke lenge hindustan'? 3) who masterminded 1993 bombay- bombblast? 4) was rubiya syed abduction episode, a true story? or mufti m. syed the then first muslim home minister had joined hands with pakistan to release 5 hardcore terrorists? > CC: vrjogi at hotmail.com; reader-list at sarai.net> From: monica at sarai.net> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] FW: FW: Guests in Vedavati's house> Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 11:50:44 +0530> To: kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com> > Vedavati,> > If you have disabled receiving mails, then it does not mean that your > mails are being blocked by anyone except yourself for yourself.> > Mots du jour like banned are easy to bandy but utterly pointless if > untrue. Useful however for creating an atmosphere of allegations and > defensiveness. Perhaps that was the intention?> > This is an administered - NOT moderated - list. As everyone by now > knows, to their edification (or boredom).> > best> M> > Monica Narula> Raqs> Sarai-CSDS> 29 Rajpur Road> Delhi 110 054> www.raqsmediacollective.net> www.sarai.net> > > On 06-Sep-07, at 10:09 PM, Kshmendra Kaul wrote:> > > Dear VJ> >> > I do not know what the glitch was if any, but this last mail of > > yours has come through SARAI.> >> > Your address in Subscribers List continues to show in parentheses > > which means your list delivery is disabled.> >> > KK> >> > Vedavati Jogi < vrjogi at hotmail.com> wrote:> > .hmmessage P { margin:0px; padding:0px } body.hmmessage > > { FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma } yes, kshemendra, my > > mails are being blocked by sarai and i am not surprised because > > this is the real nature of secularism practiced in india.> >> > this secularism will lead to disaster i am sure.> >> > few decades back britishers encouraged muslim separatism which > > ultimately resulted into partition. today same great job is being > > done by psudosecularists and i will not be surprised if one day > > muslims again start giving same slogan 'islam khatareme hai' > > leading the nation to many more partitions.> >> > 'gujrat' is a 'shame' but 'kashmir' is not!> > when one babri was pulled down then so many riots (initiated by > > muslims) took place more over their acts were justified by > > psudosecularists> > but many temples were pulled down in kashmir ...spineless hindus > > did not feel bad and ofcourse psudo secularists kept their mouths > > shut.> >> > list is very big. this is secularism. if you feel what i have > > written is not wrong please distribute it.> >> > thanks> > vj> >> >> >> > ---------------------------------> > From: vrjogi at hotmail.com> > To: tapasrayx at gmail.com; reader-list at sarai.net> > Subject: RE: [Reader-list] FW: FW: Guests in Vedavati's house> > Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 02:21:04 +0000> >> > .ExternalClass .EC_hmmessage P {padding: > > 0px;} .ExternalClass EC_body.hmmessage {font-size:10pt;font- > > family:Tahoma;} no i am not suffering from any mental problem, i > > only tell the truth which psudo secularists can not digest.> >> > vedavati> >> >> >> Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 13:02:38 +0530> >> From: tapasrayx at gmail.com> >> To: vrjogi at hotmail.com> >>>> >> Please do not forward anything to me in future. I do not > >> appreciate it.> >>> >> For your information, I have already received from Reader-list the > >> mail> >> you claim was blocked and have forwarded to me offlist.> >>> >> I suspect you may be suffering from some type of delusion or > >> paranoia.> >>> >> TR> >>> >>> >> Vedavati Jogi wrote:> >>> i have no alternative but to forward this mail to all of you> >>> individually as readers list people don't dare to publish my mail.> >>> i request all of you to please read this correspondance. views > >>> expressed> >>> by people like roger are posing real threat to this country' unity.> >>>> >>> vedavati> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>> ----> >>> From: vrjogi at hotmail.com> >>> To: rgdj12 at yahoo.com; reader-list at sarai.net> >>> Subject: RE: [Reader-list] FW: FW: Guests in Vedavati's house> >>> Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 04:55:48 +0000> >>>> >>> pakistan is an enemy so i don't blame them as they are doing what an> >>> enemy is supposed to do. i am talking against psudoseculars like> >>> you. nobody has blocked minority advancement in india otherwise> >>> shahruhk, irfan pathan, zakir hussin, javed akhtar would not have > >>> <snip>> >> >> >> > ---------------------------------> > Download the latest version of Windows Live Messenger NOW! Click > > here!> >> > ---------------------------------> > Download the latest version of Windows Live Messenger NOW! Click > > here!> >> >> > ---------------------------------> > Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone > > who knows.> > Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.> > _________________________________________> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.> > Critiques & Collaborations> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with > > subscribe in the subject header.> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list > > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>>_________________________________________________________________Windows Live Spaces is here! 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