[Reader-list] Rape Victim ordered 200 lashes and prison by Saudi judges

Fri Nov 30 20:35:18 IST 2007

You may first want to reply Shuddha's reply to your post.
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On 11/30/07, Pawan Durani <pawan.durani at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Brother Shivam ,
>
> An employee makes an organisation / future organisation and presents a thought. It anyway doesnt matter.
>
> Anyway , as an individuals one of us has to demolish the myth and it takes two to debate ?
>
> I am game for it ....are you ?
>
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> On 11/30/07, Shivam Vij <mail at shivamvij.com> wrote:
> >
> > Brother Pawan, I spoke on my own behalf, not my ex-employer. Or future employers, for that matter!
> > best
> > shivam
> >
> >
> >
> > On 11/30/07, Pawan Durani <pawan.durani at gmail.com > wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear Friend Shivam ,
> > >
> > > Let us demloish the myth . Are you ready for the debate ?
> > >
> > > On a side note , forget even saudi arabia !  Isn't the place you work for still obsessed with Gujarat while as it has has not given more than 5cc column for all the killings of hindus which have happened .
> > >
> > > I would discuss more , if you are open for a debate . But the question is .....would you ?
> > >
> > > Pawan Durani.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 11/30/07, Shivam Vij <mail at shivamvij.com > wrote:
> > > > Well the connection is, 'Look you are obsessed with Gujarat but not with
> > > > Saudi Arabia'. It assumes that one condones oppression and violence when it
> > > > comes to "Muslims" and one is thus a "pseudo-secularist". Shuddha has
> > > > demolished it well. Those who accuse others of pseudo-secularism are in fact
> > > > themselves guilty of partisan obsessions with oppression. Funny how they
> > > > seek to transpose their bias onto others.
> > > > shivam
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 11/30/07, anuradha mukherjee <anu.mukh at gmail.com > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I think Shuddha's reply has summed it up beautifully. Why should a
> > > > > horrible
> > > > > incident in Saudi Arabia be brought up to shame those who are against a
> > > > > particularly violent form of Hindutva being practised in India? What is
> > > > > the
> > > > > connection?
> > > > > Best
> > > > > Anuradha
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 11/30/07, shuddha at sarai.net <shuddha at sarai.net> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Dear Pawan,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hell comes in different flavours, as I tried to explain in an earlier
> > > > > > post,
> > > > > > and as is evident from your posting of the brutal treatment meted out to
> > > > > a
> > > > > > young woman who has been the victim of gang rape in Saudi Arabia.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Being against one kind of hell does not mean that we have to be the
> > > > > > partisans of other kinds of hell, elsewhere. The kind of intellectual
> > > > > that
> > > > > > I find interesting it the one who has no problem at all in terms of
> > > > > > evolving an engaged critique of oppression, no matter what form it
> > > > > takes,
> > > > > > no matter where it occurs. That is why, despite our respect for people
> > > > > > like
> > > > > > Noam Chomsky, some of us took it upon ourselves to sharply criticize his
> > > > > > prevaricating apology for the 'Left Front' government's violence against
> > > > > > its own subjects in West Bengal
> > > > > >
> > > > > > And so, contrary to your expectations, some of those of us who have been
> > > > > > active on this list in arguing against the Indian state's military
> > > > > > occupation of the Kashmir valley have had no problems at all in being
> > > > > > determined in our opposition to oppression when it occurs in Left Front
> > > > > > ruled West Bengal, in the current conditions of military dictatorship in
> > > > > > Burma and Pakistan, or for that matter when it occurs under the aegis of
> > > > > > the Ibn Saud dynasty in Saudi Arabia. Tomorrow, if North Korea were to
> > > > > be
> > > > > > discussed on this list, I would be certain that there will be clear
> > > > > > arguments on this list against the imbecilic regime that rules North
> > > > > Korea
> > > > > > at the moment. The list can be justifiedly expanded to include Iran, the
> > > > > > United States, Russia and many other countries and states.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Saudi Arabia is one of the most horrible places on the planet. It is
> > > > > ruled
> > > > > > by a corrupt, decadent ruling elite and kept in place by money, weapons
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > influence wielded by British and American corporate intersts and foreign
> > > > > > policy. If the international community was justified in operating a set
> > > > > of
> > > > > > sanctions against the hated South African apartheid regime, it should
> > > > > have
> > > > > > no business in cosying up to the sexist, slave-owning, xenophobic,
> > > > > > anti-semitic Saudi regime which is the favourite retirement support
> > > > > agency
> > > > > > of third rate dictators like Idi Amin and corrupt rulers like Nawaz
> > > > > > Sharif.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The Saudi Monarchy, which rose to eminence as the stooge of British
> > > > > > foreign
> > > > > > policy in the middle east in the early twentieth century presides over
> > > > > an
> > > > > > imbecilic and paranoid gloss of Islam, and the particularly Salafist
> > > > > brand
> > > > > > of Islam that is held out as an ideal by the Saudi monarchy and its
> > > > > rented
> > > > > > clerics is rightly rejected by the majority of Muslims in the world. Its
> > > > > > significance lies only in that it is backed by petro-dollars and
> > > > > American
> > > > > > fighter jets.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > One does not have to link the decadence of current Saudi Arabia to the
> > > > > > venality of Moditva/Hindutva. They are two different kinds of
> > > > > abominations
> > > > > > that need to be fought, and fought till they are destroyed. I would be
> > > > > > just
> > > > > > as happy to see Salafist Islamo-fascism perish in Saudi Arabia, as I
> > > > > would
> > > > > > be to see the short, sharp end of Moditva and Hindutva in Gujarat and in
> > > > > > India.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > regards.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Shuddha
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 2:13 pm 11/30/07 "Pawan Durani" < pawan.durani at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > Would Someone Puhleez link this to Modi , RSS & Hindutva
> > > > > > > ..........some intellectual surely would ..............
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > http://www.themuslimwoman.org/
> > > > > > > http://www.themuslimwoman.org/entry/rape-victim-ordered-200-lashes-and
> > > > > > > -prison-by-saudi-judges/
> > > > > > > What can be called a travesty of judiciary, the Saudi Arabia's Higher
> > > > > > > Judicial Council has actually sentenced a rape victim to receive 200
> > > > > > > lashes and prison while the perpetrators of humanity's most heinous
> > > > > > > crime were allowed to walk free.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The 19-year-old Shiite woman who was raped by six armed men was
> > > > > > > originally sentenced to receive 90 lashes for traveling in the car of
> > > > > > > an 'unrelated male' at the time of the rape. However after the woman
> > > > > > > had the temerity of not unquestioningly submitting herself to be
> > > > > > > tortured as punishment of being raped, the judges on Saudi Arabia's
> > > > > > > Higher Judicial Council more than doubled her punishment for
> > > > > > > attempting to influence the judiciary through the media.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Her lawyer, human right activist Abdul Rahman al-Lahem, has been
> > > > > > > banned from carrying her case further. His license has been revoked
> > > > > > > and he has been called to appear before a disciplinary committee for
> > > > > > > challenging the judgment, which only punished the victim of the crime
> > > > > > > and not its perpetrators. The Sunni rapists were given a paltry
> > > > > > > sentence of one to five years of imprisonment.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > This is the horrendous state of a country that keeps its women
> > > > > > > forcefully behind veils only to extenuate and encourage heinous
> > > > > > > crimes against them in the name of maintaining social discipline.
> > > > > > > _________________________________________
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