[Reader-list] HOW SECULAR IS INDIA TODAY?

Sat Oct 18 16:05:01 IST 2008

Hi,

As a follower of this list, would like to say that the discussion (?) is
getting a bit ridiculous.

I do not think the level of responses I have been seeing from many people
who have been great contributors (whether I agree with the point of view or
not) is worth reading now, and responses are now being done to irrelevant
sub-sections of a mail completely aside fro the topic.

Do not wish to name anyone, but I do hope all of us respect the list and the
time that all of us spend reading mails.

Rgds, Partha
.................................

On Sat, Oct 18, 2008 at 3:52 PM, Tapas Ray <tapasrayx at gmail.com> wrote:

> I do not remember seeing any abusive language in Prabhakar's posts.
> That he agrees ideologically with the really abusive ones should not
> be reason enough to lump him with them. Incidentally, Chanchal is not
> just abusive. She has even threatened physical violence against not
> only "us" but also "our children". Is this going to be tolerated?
> Please see below.
>
> 2008/10/17 chanchal malviya <chanchal_malviya at yahoo.com>:
>
> > We will wait for the time.. If not you, your children will surely have to
> answer to your anti-national concept of Secularism and anti-Hindutva...
> Because you are betraying the very character of this motherland -
> Hinduism....
> >
>
>
> 2008/10/18 Prabhakar Singh <prabhakardelhi at yahoo.com>:
> > Aarti has written without even reading my mails.I dare her to point out
> even one instance where I have used any abusive language so far.In her
> description she has been using only mild abuses by her standards and now we
> have to be prepared to tolerate her real hard abuses.If the
> Administrator/Moderator does not wish to take action against such people,
> he/she should be kind enough to delist me and save me from such abuses.We
> are respectable people not used to this kind of abuse and insult.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Aarti Sethi <aarti.sethi at gmail.com>
> > To: Aditya Raj Kaul <kauladityaraj at gmail.com>
> > Cc: sarai list <reader-list at sarai.net>
> > Sent: Saturday, 18 October, 2008 2:37:02 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Reader-list] HOW SECULAR IS INDIA TODAY?
> >
> > Dear Crybabies,
> >
> > This is fantastic. After two years of spewing disgusting vitriol at
> anyone
> > who is not a right wing Hindu apologist, you now turn around and urge the
> > moderator to intervene on your behalf! Why? Because Shuddha called
> Chanchal
> > a 'moron'. 'Moron'  'fool' 'idiot' and 'nonsense' according to Prabhakar
> is
> > "filthy language". I actually thought it so mild compared to the filth
> that
> > routinely issues from the likes of Chanchal, Aditya, Vedavati, Prabhakar
> and
> > radhukarajen (who has thankfully left us), that I really don't see why
> you
> > are so upset. Perhaps because Shuddha is not trading in invective, he is
> > simply calling Chanchal out on his ridiculous views.
> >
> > The trouble is you think that you have a divine right to say whatever you
> > wish to the "psuedo-secularists" right? Because by in large we are
> > well-mannered people, unwilling for the most part to indulge in
> > invective-trading no matter how much we are provoked. We care a great
> deal
> > about this list, about rational discussion and so on. So even though you
> > routinely abuse everyone's intelligence, time, faith and beleifs in
> sexist,
> > racist, misogynist prose, we solidier on. Trying to steer the
> conversation
> > in other directions, knowing that your immaturity and stupidity should
> not
> > be held against you. But sometimes everyone's patience runs out when
> > confronted with evidence of such blatant ignorance at the service of
> > prejudice that they are forced to react in exasperation. Thus Shuddha
> called
> > Chanchal a moron when Chanchal made the astounding statement that Hindus
> do
> > not have special personal laws when in fact the most rudimentary
> knowledge
> > of Indian law would reveal that every "community" has separate personal
> > laws. However in this case I think Shuddha is wrong.
> >
> > Here is a small sample of Chanchal's views on a variety of issues:
> >
> > Chanchal on Muslim women:
> >
> > "He..he.. does it matter... you marry four or as many as possible... four
> is
> > from your own religion.. and the rest is that your Right hand
> possesses..."
> >
> > "You do not require rape in your community... there is freedom of having
> > more than one wife.."
> >
> > Chanchal on Hindu Women:
> >
> > "This is the basic culture of Hindus... The events that you talk about
> > (mistreatment of women) takes place with girls and women who have
> discarded
> > their religion.. they want freedom like western girl and they are facing
> > problems alike western girls...  I am very clear on a simple point - if a
> > girl or woman knows to have respect and honor for herself, no Hindus will
> > ever try to even look at her even
> > in disguise - this is the true meaning of Satitva"
> >
> > Chanchal on Indian History:
> >
> > "They [Muslims] looted, massacred and raped Indians (Hindus) in the name
> of
> > Infidels. Captured all our temples and palaces including Taj Mahal and
> > declared that it is their property....
> >
> > Chanchal on International relations:
> >
> > "The world knows that trucks of Women are exported by Pakistan to India
> (all
> > HIV effected) for spreading AIDS in India."
> >
> > Chanchal on Art:
> >
> > "I am sure, a person who paints his motherland nude, must have done much
> > more nonsense to his mother and sister (though he may not be exposing it
> to
> > the world)..."
> >
> > Chanchal on Sex:
> >
> > "Sex is nothing but the power of nature to brood."
> >
> > Chanchal on Secularism:
> >
> > "Hinduism is the mother of this nation and this nation remains secular as
> > long as Hindus are in majority."
> > "Let India be a pure HIndu country again... For Muslims or Christians -
> all
> > are safe in the hand of Hindus only..."
> >
> > Shuddha you are wrong to have called Chanchal a moron when it is obvious
> we
> > are in the presence of a deeply learned person. I would request you to
> > immediately apologise.
> >
> > Warmly
> > Aarti
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Oct 18, 2008 at 12:00 PM, Aditya Raj Kaul
> > <kauladityaraj at gmail.com>wrote:
> >
> >> Seems the SARAI Moderator WAKES UP only when some particular members are
> in
> >> trouble in an argument and have no words left. This is most shocking on
> >> part
> >> of so called List Administrators..
> >>
> >> So called Freedom Lovers....Pathetic Liberals....in dreams of their own.
> >>
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-- 
Partha Dasgupta
+919811047132