[Reader-list] To Ban or Not to Ban, that is the question

[radhikarajen at vsnl.net]

Inder 

   Your wordplay is too good. But issue here is not only about banning, but stern action against anyone of deviant behaviour against humanity.

 According to me, there should not be ban either on SIMI or on any religious outfit. But if individuals involve in illegal actions, the rule of laws should be applied post haste, firm action is what needed. If SIMI wants islamic rule, not accepting the democratic constitution, such of those in SIMI should be prosecuted and punishment should be exemplary. If a bhajarani mahendra Kumar says on tv that churches should be attacked for conversion, he is now arrested and is in jail. If a bishop asks his people to retaliate with stones, he should be in jail for taking law in his hands. That is secular democratic rule. a Veerappa Moily and a Oscar saying that operation Hand has started and the goos attack churches and this need to be specifically investigated as these are losers for ages in all elections, staying in Ivory towers thanks to loyalty to first family. If guilty, without demur, these big guns have to be behind the bars just as the Patron of new Life trust who says convers
ion is alright, and because he is BJP MP, who has taken 25 crores for a vote on N-deal, he is not to be spared.

  Rule of laws shall be same for the individuals irrespective of their closeness to party and politics.
Regards. 

----- Original Message -----
From: inder salim <indersalim at gmail.com>
Date: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:47 pm
Subject: [Reader-list] To Ban or Not to Ban, that is the question
To: reader-list at sarai.net

> To Ban or not to Ban, that is the question…
> 
> Right now, there is a  clear majority of those who want to ban 
> SIMI (
> The Muslim right wing's  poltical… )  in comparison to those who want
> a simultaneous ban on Bajrang Dal/VHP ( the Hindu Right wing's
> political…). There are some who don't want to see them compared at
> all, and there are some who don't want a ban at all.  I personally
> want a ban on both, since the one is banned  and not the other.   And
> since, an absolute no ban demand on political outfits by Shuddha has
> opened my ( inner ) sceptic eye in me, I want to listen a little more
> on it, If the learned List members share their respective convictions
> on the subject.
> 
> I quote history, "Early in 1925, Hitler visited the Prime 
> Minister of
> Bavaria and managed to convince him to lift the ban, on the 
> promise of
> good behavior, and after promising that the Nazis would work within
> the rules of the democratic constitution. He then wrote a long
> editorial for the Völkischer Beobachter called "A New Beginning"
> published February 26, 1925".
> 
> This is a classic case where banning  was frustrating Nazis, but this
> may be not have happened always. Certainly RSS in India gained more
> ground after ban.
> 
> On the surface, both SIMI and RSS don't bring themselves directly in
> the act. They entrust a job to themselves which moulds a basic member
> into a soldier like thing, who is ready is fight.  In case of SIMI it
> looks there is a ready-made situation ( unfortunately designed by
> world politics )  out there, which employs these soldiers to commit
> the crime, in collaboration with any group, mafia even, and commit the
> act.  But in case of RSS group, they wait just for the right
> opportunities to strike. So, it takes just an Advani to bring these
> soldiers together to bring down a mosque, and a  Bal  Thakrey to
> organize Riots in Mumbia, a Modi to castrate the entire minority in
> Gujarat. etc.  The situation in fact is quite Friz Lang's M for Murder
> like film, in which there is a working nexus between criminals and
> police, against a psy-killer ( murdering children ).  Here, the
> psy-killer can be found anywhere, floating freely in police between
> SIMI and RSS.  They can go up the tomb without realizing that thre are
> some other guys who are pulling the pillar of the mosque, and there
> are some others who tie explosives round their wait. ( this is 
> just a
> case to make a contrast, otherwise there are many other numerous
> instances where criminals become gurus, and gurus become criminals,
> not only in politics, but market even ).
> 
> Ban is a funny tool in the hands of authorities. These days our Health
> Minister is after Cigarette smoking.  Earlier he banned smoking in
> cinema, which he believes influences the younger generation to ruin
> their lungs, and now he has banned smoking in all public places.  I
> don't feel  the ban works effectively in Cinema, but to ban 
> smoking in
> public places is certainly a effective tool. Particularly in buses and
> Metros. That is that, but banning Books is certainly not working at
> all. Banning art and other expressions of thought is really a
> dangerous thing to do. The society is so much structured that banning
> mental faculties from expressions of thought will make us really
> barren and dry. Although paradoxes remain, but one thing is clear that
> banning is not a universal word and functions differently in different
> cases. For example, the ban on Sati practice is obviously a huge
> protection against the heinous crimes committed  against hapless
> women. Needless to say that there are lot of Hindu Male believers who
> think Sati a spiritual practice, almost designed by Gods themselves,
> like Manu Simriti.
> 
> To cut it short, I would like to come back to the point… where we
> actually are supposed to notice ' the crime' in order to fix the
> person for the machinery of Law to take over ? So to ban or no ban ?
> 
> I will come back to history.   A very interesting case,  how Fascism
> in Italy gained ground in 1925, but only after there was a big murder.
> Those who are interested may read the following.
> 
> http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/murder_of_matteotti.htm
> Giacomo Matteotti verbal attacks on Mussolini lead to his murder.
> Matteotti was one of the brave people in Italy who dared to speak out
> against Mussolini. Matteotti was a socialist (he was head of the
> Italian Socialist Party) and therefore shared none of the views of the
> post-March on Rome Mussolini. Matteotti was not afraid to speak his
> mind – but this bravery was to cost him his life.
> On June 10th 1924, Matteotti disappeared. On August 18th his body was
> found in a grave just outside of Rome. A carpenter's file had been
> driven into his chest.
> Matteotti's death created outrage in Italy and it nearly cost
> Mussolini his political career. Ironically, it also gave him the
> opportunities to expand his power in Italy – the very thing that
> Matteotti had warned people about.
> In the early months of 1924, Mussolini had created the ceka. Its task
> was to frighten people at elections so that they voted for the
> Fascists. Two members of the ceka were Albino Volpi and Amerigo
> Dumini. Both were professional gangsters and both were employed by
> Mussolini. They received daily pay from Mussolini's press office.
> Historians such as Denis Mack Smith believe that these men were
> employed with the one specific task of getting rid of Matteotti.
> On May 30th 1924, Matteotti made an passionate speech in Rome
> condemning Mussolini's leadership of Italy. He declared that the 1924
> election was a fraud and that the Fascists had won it using violence
> and a system corrupted by the Acerbo Law. He was clearly seen as a
> threat to Mussolini and his speeches had the potential of undermining
> Mussolini's position.
> On June 10th, Matteotti disappeared. People in the street where he
> lived had noticed that his house was being watched and they
> specifically noticed a Lancia car parked in the street which did not
> belong to anyone in that street. One man had taken the registration
> number of the car and after Matteotti had disappeared, he gave this
> number to the police. The police quickly traced the car and found
> blood on the back seat. This was in an era before DNA testing and the
> finding of blood itself did not specifically link the car to
> Matteotti.
> However, Mussolini must have felt so vulnerable that he ordered the
> arrest of Dumini and the men who were part of his 'gang'. Between June
> 15th and June 22nd, Dumini was questioned by the police. During this
> time some of the evidence relating to the case disappeared - as did
> many members of the ceka who went into hiding. Who disposed of the
> evidence and who tipped off the members of the ceka?
> On August 18th 1924, Matteotti's body was found in a shallow grave
> just outside of Rome. Now Dumini was charged with murder and sent to
> prison.
> There is no evidence to link Mussolini to the murder. It is possible
> that he did order it but that cannot be proved. It could also be the
> case that Dumini was simply being over loyal to his boss and decided
> himself that Matteotti was a threat to Mussolini's power and had 
> to be
> eliminated. His murder could have been a demonstration of Dumini's
> loyalty to Mussolini who always denied any knowledge about the
> circumstances of the murder
> 
> However, people in Italy did not believe this and 1924 is the year
> that was Mussolini's most testing in terms of maintaining his grip on
> Italy. Mussolini resorted to promising that any violent men in the
> Fascist Party would be kicked out and he sacked three Fascist
> ministers from his cabinet. This caused problems in the Fascist
> movement itself. There were those who saw Mussolini as being too soft
> and giving in to the population too easily - so it appeared as if
> Mussolini was losing public support and support from within the
> Fascist Party. Fifty senior officers in his private army - the 
> MVSN -
> stormed into his office in Rome and demanded that he rule as a
> dictator or they would overthrow him and put someone tougher in power.
> Mussolini decided to become tougher.
> 
> Warmly
> Inder salim
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> http://indersalim.livejournal.com
> _________________________________________
> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> Critiques & Collaborations
> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with 
> subscribe in the subject header.
> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-
> list 
> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>