[Reader-list] Feudalism in Pakistan

Wed Aug 5 11:51:48 IST 2009

Dear Murali,     for many spokespersons, self appointed, that is, like
Rakesh, in the hope of catching the grace of prince charming to be in
politics, the only way to reply is brand others as "religious" and it is his
right to perceive me as he prefers, I need not clarify or assent or disagree
with him about my person being religious which I am not.
      For me , God is in all living beings, not in any place of worships, as
these place of worships are only reflection of their "shraddha",   (devotion
does not comprehend all the intricacies of the word shraddha) in their
faiths. I prefer to use the words which convey full meanings as English is
foreign to me,use it for good for communication to the extent possible with
words known to me.

   As to his conclusion that "obsession" of mine, it is his learned opinion
which he has right to rightly or otherwise.

As to the post of the learned friend, Abbasi, it is a fact that in any
nation, inspite of democratic rule, the feudal lords always hold the power,
for their gains, belonging to different faiths, castes and clans, even in
India, yadav, reddy and gowdas are too many to mention, and ofcourse who can
overlook a owaisi, anthony and many who camouflage the faith with  common
names in circulation like rahul Roberto maino or a priyanka Elisabeth Vadhra
or a mahesh batt..? In Pakistan, the fuedal lords lord over the system much
more than in this nation in their area of command.This is a major difference
in the nations of Pakistan and India.

It is amusing that when I reiterate that good of governance shall be to all,
no to discrimination on the basis of faith, caste and region, that these
spokespersons become super active.?

Regards,

Rajen.
On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 9:36 AM, Murali V <murali.chalam at gmail.com> wrote:

> Dear Rakesh Ji,
>
> Here are some of the very word of Gandhi.
> On Conversion and In this respect, it is very pertinent to read what
> Mahatma
> Gandhi said during his time. "If instead of confining themselves purely to
> humanitarian work such as education, medical services to the poor and the
> like, they would use these activities of their for the purpose of
> proselytising, I would certainly like them to withdraw.  Every nation
> considers its own faith to be as good as that of any other.  Certainly the
> great faiths held by the people of India are Adequate for her people.
>  India
> stands in no need of conversion from one faith to another." (M.  K. Gandhi,
> "Foreign Missionaries," Young India, April 23, 1931, p.83.)"
>
> Just how strongly Gandhi felt about Christian missionaries in India can be
> gauged from his recorded comments: "If I had the power and could legislate,
> I should certainly stop all proselytising.
> " 1. Gandhi's writing: "The effect of Christianity upon India in
> general...has been disastrous." Shourie, p.6)
> <
> http://www.ndtvgoodtimes.com/mb/readreply.asp?topicid=990&id=917103&tablename=News
> >
> 2. Gandhi to Krezenski, a visiting professor of Philosophy from Poland, who
> had told him that Catholicism was the only true religion : "The idea of
> conversion, I assure you is the deadliest poison that ever sapped the
> fountain of truth." (Shourie, p.11)
> <
> http://www.ndtvgoodtimes.com/mb/readreply.asp?topicid=990&id=917103&tablename=News
> >
> 3. Gandhi to a visiting missionary nurse: "The other day a missionary
> descended on a famine area with money in his pocket, distributed it among
> the famine-stricken, converted them to his fold, took charge of their
> temple
> and demolished it. This is outrageous. This friend goes and gets it
> demolished at the hands of the very men who only a little while ago
> believed
> that God was there." (Shourie, p. 17)
> <
> http://www.ndtvgoodtimes.com/mb/readreply.asp?topicid=990&id=917103&tablename=News
> >
> 4. Gandhiji: "If I had the power and could legislate, I should certainly
> stop all proselytising." (Collected Works, Vol 61, page 46-47; Shourie, p.
> 38).
> <
> http://www.ndtvgoodtimes.com/mb/readreply.asp?topicid=990&id=917103&tablename=News
> >
> 5. Several missionaries tried to convert Gandhi. When they failed, one of
> the reverend gentlemen, writes Mahadev Desai, "retired with the
> imprecation...'Mr. Gandhi, soon there will come a day when you will be
> judged, not in your righteousness, but in the righteousness of Jesus.' "
> (Collected Works, Vol 60, p.323; Shourie, p. 240) Gandhiji drew attention
> to
> it again and again. The services were incidental. They were the means. The
> objective was to convert the natives to Christianity. "The Collected Works
> of Gandhi" contain several accounts as do Mahadev Desai's "Diaries" in
> which
> missionaries acknowledged to Gandhiji that the institutions and services
> are
> incidental, that the aim is to gather a fuller harvest of converts for the
> Church. Our father of the nation, Mahatma Gandhi, with all his religious
> tolerance, was extremely articulate in opposing the conversion activities
> of
> Christian missionaries in India and questioned their motives in
> establishing
> educational institutions and other services in India. Just how strongly
> Gandhi felt about Christian missionaries in India can be gauged from his
> following recorded comment: Gandhiji: "If I had the power and could
> legislate, I should certainly stop all proselytising." (Collected Works,
> Vol
> 61, page 46-47;)<
> http://www.ndtvgoodtimes.com/mb/readreply.asp?topicid=990&id=917103&tablename=News
> >
>
> Regards,
> V Murali
> On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 6:35 PM, Rakesh Iyer <rakesh.rnbdj at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Dear Rajen jee
> >
> > Even Gandhi jee, inspite of being faithful, was not too obsessed to
> > religion
> > like you are. And he used religion in a positive sense (not many know but
> > he
> > asked good Hindus to prove themselves to be good Hindus by fighting
> against
> > the British rule, in a non-violent way of course).
> >
> > So faith need not always be a problem. And please don't mix issues. I
> hope
> > in reply to this, you will not send another mail which adds more issues
> to
> > this, like Manmohan being a transgender, defence scams, media being
> > elitist,
> > RSS being always attacked.....Sach ka Saamna being against Indian
> > culture...blah...blah...blah....
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Rakesh
> > _________________________________________
> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> > Critiques & Collaborations
> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
> > subscribe in the subject header.
> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list
> > List archive: &lt;https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>
> _________________________________________
> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> Critiques & Collaborations
> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
> subscribe in the subject header.
> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list
> List archive: &lt;https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>

-- 
Rajen.