[Reader-list] Crime and No Punishment: Malegaon Blast Accused Get a Respite

Thu Aug 13 18:54:00 IST 2009

Thanks for your words of encouragement. I shall engrave this on my wall. and
trust me, your biases are very relevant in our times. I hope announcing
one's biases in this reader's forum laced with historical vengeance is
better than corrupting young minds with propaganda of extreme patrotism,
hardening the spiritual self and turning into political demon. Killing
meditative devotion with the sword of impassionate ideological stance.
Unfortunately, liberated minds are those stripped of *gunas *or qualities.

On 8/13/09, Rajendra Bhat Uppinangadi <rajen786uppinangady at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Anupam
>
>     I am talking of a society where all of us live as citizens of India,
> without reference to any faith, but if you choose to link it in any way, it
> is your choice as free citizen of the nation.You can have the right of
> expression to say peddling and any such lofty words which are normal in the
> left parties and pseudo seculars, but for me, in India all
> are Indians first, all other facets come later., without affecting the
> character of the nation, to live in harmony.
>
>
>  The right to disagree is the basic tenet of a good system of democratic
> rule, if you think you have a better idealogy, it is for you to explore it,
> but having seen the socialist at work, communism at work and also populism
> at work, my belief is in rule of laws, without fear or favour to any class,
> caste or faith, even region.
>
>
>  If you have any misgivings and bias it is for you to search out the
> answers instead of being parroting the same old half truths, lies. Criticism
> is good, so I am neither displeased, nor unhappy as long it is not in the
> form of violence, as harsh words only reflect your bad understanding,
> illogical bias and reservations of mind to listen to other thoughts in a
> discussion.Saint poet of Karnataka, Purandara Dasa has said in his divine
> melodies, critics are needed in the society, only then a place of life will
> be clean, as they scavenge all filth.Many such quotes are available in sufi
> songs also.
>
>
> If some choose to play with words, to criticise, that is perfectly alright
> as it is the right of expression, you are expressing it in your style, keep
> going......!  :  -)
>
> On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 5:45 PM, anupam chakravartty <c.anupam at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Dear Rajen
>>
>> "society always recognizes that terrorist apprehended is muslim by name,
>> but
>> muslims are not terrorists."
>>
>>
>> Which society are you referring to sir? People who you can incite by
>> saying
>> such things. speaking ill for one community in such a way is really
>> horrible
>> sir. you are a senior person here. you contradict the first line that you
>> are citing: "propaganda by few for their livelihood is not new to society,
>> but the individuals in society can feel the difference of the words and
>> actions."
>>
>>
>> I am individual whether u notice or not, i can say that you are peddling
>> your RSS propaganda through this forum. You do it very consciously, making
>> statements about the society and other such things. had you been a just,
>> an
>> unbiased person, you would NOT have said these lines. your problem with
>> the
>> muslims are historical, the present generation (people who earn their
>> livelihoods from the muslim community) have not done anything wrong to you
>> per se. why dont you speak against arun gawli, or violent MNS, or gujarati
>> rioters who are seeking refuge in US and UK, absconding trial? these are
>> also terrorists. they went around in jeeps plundering killing people
>> across
>> the fields. there are live footages of that as proof. because of the sick
>> judiciary of gujarat, these cases have been turned into cliches. why would
>> you speak? after all, you consider yourself to be this self styled
>> preacher
>> for the aspirational indian who wants to toil hard in the sun, and earn
>> his
>> own livelihood. your vested interest lies in the fact that you want to
>> establish a land for hindus. you justify their actions as reactions. you
>> have been doing so. please do not ask me show examples, because if i do
>> you'd be defaced here. so stop spewing venom and yes this is very much a
>> personal attack on you sir. it is utterly disgusting for me to read such
>> views, however i consider this forum also as an outlet for expression. the
>> democratic right that you use here to express your views also comes with
>> duties. so please keep your propaganda aside. do not make these
>> categorical
>> judgements instead cite the particulars. it helps one to cite contrary
>> also
>> and then may be a decisive debate. this name-suggestion business in
>> apprehending terrorist only lasts because these names are used/abused
>> sometimes by their own community and on other occasions by people like
>> you,
>> who have these ideas that terrorists are some kind of alien race. NO they
>> are very much from here, from this mind which has been poisoned by this
>> sectarian politics. the underworld, the mafia, the ideological guerilla,
>> the
>> terrorists (islamic or hindu) are born out of conflicts. because we do not
>> have conflict resolution mechanisms in place anywhere in the world.
>> because
>> we prefer the easy way out just by bombing, or sending young minds on to
>> the
>> seas to attack innocent people.
>>
>> i apologise if i am harsh here but your statements are beginning make me
>> think i should discard india as a country. it should just seize to exist
>> as
>> the chinese have foolishly proposed.
>>
>> -anupam
>>
>>
>>
>> On 8/12/09, Rajendra Bhat Uppinangadi <rajen786uppinangady at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Dear Javed,
>> > propaganda by few for their livelihood is not new to society, but the
>> > individuals in society can feel the difference of the words and actions.
>> In
>> > any organisation, when volunteers are many, some may be deviant, some
>> > compliant, that is the reason, society always recognizes that terrorist
>> > apprehended is muslim by name, but muslims are not terrorists.Like any
>> > other
>> > deviants some on the fringes may feel that they have to retaliate the
>> > violence, but what individuals in society fail to understand is violence
>> > only breeds more of it. There are enough propaganda and speeches that go
>> on
>> > in society, after nammaaz I also had to bear the hate speech on the
>> > loudspeakers regularly but that does not mean that mulsims are preaching
>> > hatred, only some mullas do it for their collecton to soar.!
>> >
>> > And there are new type of evangelists who are "chrstian brahmins" who
>> > preach "vedas" for the gullible,  with foreign funds,as the new bible of
>> > Veda.!
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> >
>> > Rajen.
>> >
>> > On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 7:07 PM, Javed <javedmasoo at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Dear Rajen
>> > > You say that "RSS does not hate Muslims or Christians", but you seem
>> > > to be ignoring all the hate-propaganda literature that is produced by
>> > > RSS and its allies, and the fact that RSS shakhas in small towns
>> > > brainwash little children against Muslims. Have you seen these 2
>> > > documentary films called "Boys in the Branch" and "Men in the Trees"
>> > > (directed by Lalit Vachani) that explore exactly how the RSS
>> > > infiltrates the minds of youngsters. Do watch them if you can.
>> > > Working for the nation is fine, but at whose cost?
>> > >
>> > > J
>> > >
>> > > On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 4:01 PM, Rajendra Bhat
>> > > Uppinangadi<rajen786uppinangady at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > > Rakesh jee,
>> > > >   you have your intellect to analyse and judge, you are free citizen
>> of
>> > > > India, but your sweeping judgement of RSS is absolutely wrong, and
>> you
>> > > are
>> > > > entitled to your views, but alteast have the patience to see the
>> > working
>> > > of
>> > > > RSS before you start quoting from the articles of regular baiters
>> like
>> > > > Ashish Nandy and the tribe of pseudo -seculars, let me re-assert,
>> RSS
>> > > does
>> > > > not hate muslims or christians, RSS men and women are volantary men
>> and
>> > > > women who work for the nation , that too with the hope that the wall
>> in
>> > > the
>> > > > partition of 1947 will be brought down, all live with harmony and
>> peace
>> > > > irrespective of their faith, no faith followers dominating the
>> > "majority"
>> > > or
>> > > > "minority" on the basis of faith, converting from faiths to garner
>> > votes
>> > > > with vote banks.
>> > > > Muslims demanded partition and got it, but worked and struggled with
>> > all
>> > > > against slavery and  the British rule, but the land mass was not
>> loot
>> > > after
>> > > > robbery to be distributed after freedom. Only 23 percent went to the
>> > > > partitioned land, rest assured the leaders and the nation that they
>> > will
>> > > be
>> > > > living harmoniously with their hindu brothers, but we have seen the
>> > > deviant
>> > > > in them, and the silent majority of muslims tolerating such deviants
>> > with
>> > > > NGOs.
>> > > > As to the deviants of the lot, they are emboldened by the fact that
>> > they
>> > > > though, in very small quantum, numerically, have supporters in so
>> > > > called pseudo seculars who have love of freedom to fight for any
>> faith
>> > as
>> > > > legal., but not hindu, because then it is communal, not secular.!
>> > > > Regards,
>> > > > Rajen.
>> > > >
>> > > > On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Rakesh Iyer <
>> rakesh.rnbdj at gmail.com>
>> > > wrote:
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Dear Rajen jee
>> > > >>
>> > > >> While it certainly is a questionable practice not to declassify the
>> > > >> documents of intelligence of about more than 30 years ago, you seem
>> to
>> > > make
>> > > >> a complete mockery of the investigations in the Malegaon case, as
>> if
>> > > Hindus
>> > > >> can not be party to any terror blasts within the country, more so
>> > those
>> > > who
>> > > >> believe in the 'Hindutva' ideology.
>> > > >>
>> > > >> This is a wrong value-based position and I strongly disagree with
>> it.
>> > > One
>> > > >> must not forget that the Sangh Parivar is such is based on the
>> > > ideological
>> > > >> position of disregarding the rights of the minorities to a life of
>> > > dignity,
>> > > >> and this is certainly a shame when compared with the ideals on
>> which
>> > the
>> > > >> Indian Constitution was and is still based. (Unless of course you
>> > > believe
>> > > >> that the Constitution itself is a shame to begin with).
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Any matter must be thoroughly investigated and only after proper
>> > > >> investigations should we derive conclusions from it. Whether it be
>> > > Malegaon
>> > > >> or Mumbai blasts, this should be the way to go. Also, if matters
>> > > relating to
>> > > >> the case are present in the public domain, they should be presented
>> to
>> > > the
>> > > >> public from the point of view of both sides (the accuser and the
>> > > accused).
>> > > >> And specifically, if people have doubts regarding the direction or
>> > > certain
>> > > >> matters within the case, these can and should be raised in the
>> media
>> > and
>> > > >> elsewhere for public discussion.
>> > > >>
>> > > >> The shameful part is that in India, when someone is claimed to be a
>> > > >> terrorist, he/she is taken to be one irrespective of whether the
>> final
>> > > >> investigations indeed state the same or not. The basic notion of
>> > > 'innocent
>> > > >> until proven guilty' is reversed to be stated as 'guilty even if
>> > termed
>> > > >> innocent by courts' in such cases. Whether it be Geelani or Sadhvi
>> > > Pragya
>> > > >> Thakur, that has happened. I have not seen the concerned articles
>> as
>> > > >> mentioned by Mr. Puniyani, but I believe that unless one has
>> evidence
>> > to
>> > > >> prove the judgement as wrong, or valid questions regarding the
>> basis
>> > on
>> > > >> which the judgement was made, one should not make atrocious
>> > allegations
>> > > of
>> > > >> this kind.
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Therefore, on the same grounds as I feel that Puniyani jee's side
>> may
>> > be
>> > > >> wrong, I equally feel that your side can also be wrong.
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Regards
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Rakesh
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > --
>> > > > Rajen.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Rajen.
>>
>>  > _________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
> Rajen.
>
>
>