[Reader-list] Election Forecast

Sun Jun 14 16:13:44 IST 2009

Dear Sonia

You brought in the comparison with "Hafta". Well that is exactly what "Jaziya" is. It is 'protection money'.

Agree with you that there is no provision in Pakistan's Constitution that would allow imposition of "Jaziya". 

In Pakistan, the Taliban, TNSM and others of similar leanings do not accept the validity of the Constitution or the Executive or the Judiciary.

Kshmendra

--- On Sat, 6/13/09, S. Jabbar <sonia.jabbar at gmail.com> wrote:

From: S. Jabbar <sonia.jabbar at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Election Forecast
To: "Kshmendra Kaul" <kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com>
Cc: "Sarai" <reader-list at sarai.net>
Date: Saturday, June 13, 2009, 8:33 PM

Pakistan is still governed by constitutional law where jaziya does not find a place despite the clamour by some sections to impose the Sharia.  The ‘tax’ imposed by the Taliban is nothing other than ‘hafta’ in the guise of jaziya.

From: Kshmendra Kaul <kshmendra2005 at yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 02:30:20 -0700 (PDT)
To: "S. Jabbar" <sonia.jabbar at gmail.com>
Cc: Sarai <reader-list at sarai.net>
Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Election Forecast

There are some practices that pre-date Islam (in terms of Quran-Mohammad) but found themselves 'sanctified' through the Quran and/or the reported words/practices of Mohammad. "Jaziya" is one such Practice/Law.

There are many explanations and interpretations given for "Jaziya" with respect to 'Non-Muslim individuals' and 'entities conquered through war or threatened with war'.

In current times, "Jaziya paid by Non-Muslims" could perhaps best be explained as being equivalent to "Zakaat paid by Muslims" 

Kshmendra  

--- On Fri, 6/12/09, S. Jabbar <sonia.jabbar at gmail.com> wrote:

From: S. Jabbar <sonia.jabbar at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Election Forecast
To: "Vedavati Jogi" <vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com>, "Rakesh Iyer" <rakesh.rnbdj at gmail.com>
Cc: "Sarai" <reader-list at sarai.net>
Date: Friday, June 12, 2009, 2:21 PM

The people in the NWFP who imposed a tax on non-Muslims in the name of Islam
are brigands.  They are also known collectively as the Taliban, a feared
entity who have wreaked greater havoc on the lives of Muslims in the area.

Jaziya is commonly and mistakenly seen as an inherent Islamic practice, a
fundamental tenet of Islam, where in fact the Arabs simply continued the
practice of levying a poll tax on subject races in their newly conquered
territories.  

The practice of poll tax was instituted by the Sassanid Empire, which ruled
a vast swathe of land which included the Caucasus, Iraq, southern Central
Asia, Iran and Afghanistan from 205 CE for 400 years, much before the birth
of Islam.  

The Sassanids, incidentally, were Zoroastrian, ancestors of the people we
know as Parsis.  

> From: Vedavati Jogi <vedavati_jogi at yahoo.com <http://us.mc572.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=vedavati_jogi@yahoo.com> >
> Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 10:25:13 +0530 (IST)
> To: Rakesh Iyer <rakesh.rnbdj at gmail.com <http://us.mc572.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rakesh.rnbdj@gmail.com> >
> Cc: <reader-list at sarai.net <http://us.mc572.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=reader-list@sarai.net> >
> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Election Forecast
> 
> after reading secular mails on this readers list i am thoroughly convinced
> that very soon india will be a muslim country because muslims are going to
> outnumber hindus by 2050 and hindus will have to pay jizia (the way sikhs in
> pakistan are paying)

( unfortunately or fortunately )muslims don't
> descriminate between seculars and others 
for them hindus are hindus and not
> brahmins/dalits/marathas/seculars/communals etc. 
so all of us - you as well
> as me will have to pay jizia. 

be mentally ( and financially also)
> prepared.

vedavati

--- On Mon, 18/5/09, Rakesh Iyer
> <rakesh.rnbdj at gmail.com <http://us.mc572.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rakesh.rnbdj@gmail.com> > wrote:

From: Rakesh Iyer
> <rakesh.rnbdj at gmail.com <http://us.mc572.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rakesh.rnbdj@gmail.com> >
Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Election Forecast
To:
> "anupam chakravartty" <c.anupam at gmail.com <http://us.mc572.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=c.anupam@gmail.com> >
Cc: "sarai list"
> <reader-list at sarai.net <http://us.mc572.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=reader-list@sarai.net> >
Date: Monday, 18 May, 2009, 5:20 PM

Dear
> Vedavati

Before pointing fingers at others, look at oneself. Considering the
> demand
of Hindus like you, if BJP were to come to power (either as coalition
> or on
their own), the sword would be hanging on the head of the minorities as
> to
when their women would be raped, their children would be left
> parent-less
and when their lives would be destroyed. It's certainly good that
> UPA has
come to power, and now we have one less issue to focus upon (which
> is
minority rights), at least upto a certain extent.

When the NDA was in
> power, we had to focus on jokers like Praveen Togadia,
Ashok Singhal, Acharya
> Dharmendra, some more useless sadhus and mahants, and
also Modi mania.
> Unnecessarily at some point of time or other, there would
be some nonsense
> shilanyas and some daan or the other. At least under the
UPA, such useless
> antics are out. While Kandhamal, Karnataka and Mangalore
indeed have taken
> place, at least a widespread pogrom has not taken place.

And as for
> Bangladesh and Pakistan, thanks to Hindus like you, I can say
comfortably that
> if people like you were to come to power (in any party or
form), we would
> become a Hindu rashtra where our minorities would be living
worse than second
> class citizens. And you are not a secular anyway, and you
are a Hindu.

India
> is secular not because Hindus are in majority. India is secular
because
> majority of the people live as a secular society does (irrespective
of whether
> they believe in secularism). They don't want conflicts for
umpteen no. of
> reasons. And they can see through the political game of our
Hindutva and
> fundamentalist Islamic friends.

As for Muslim nations which are secular, go
> to Turkey, Indonesia and
Malaysia.

Regards

Rakesh

PS: I wonder where our
> Modi bhai is, now that results are out for the
general election. Everybody is
> talking about Advani not talking to media.
Seems Modi is another version of
> Advani. When things are going against him,
he is the first one (like Advani)
> to hide and run away. And he is supposedly
the 'next PM' candidate of BJP in
> 2014.

Jaisa Guru, waisa chela........jai
> ho!!
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