[Reader-list] "A Hindu army officer and an Indian patriot..."

[Lalit Ambardar]

Indian borders in most parts
are inhospitable. Therefore, tax payer’s money does not go into defending Kashmir alone. Even if you were to offer Kashmir on a platter your border only moves a bit closer to where ever you are
& tax payer’s money will still go into maintaining & defending that border. And then if
you think everything there after will be hunky- dory, no you are mistaken. Pan
Islamists have a declared target on their agenda i.e. to hoist their flag on
Red Fort in Delhi (Pakistan was granted in a jiffy & it did not stop at that).

 

Kashmir is a test for the survival of secular Indian state &
the argument that it is not worth spending tax payer’s money in defending its integrity
is a stale one. In order to be able to generate resources & to be able to pay
& collect taxes you have to have a state & you will always need to
defend that state.

 

By the way never heard any
body complaining about tax payer’s money being spent in far away Afghanistan in even worst conditions.

 

And whose aspirations are we
talking about? Of the patriarch of ‘azadi- bara- e- Islam' (freedom through
Islam) Gillani or Moolvi Farooq (who is supposed to be a preacher but doubles
as a separatist) who do not see an eye to eye with each other? Or is it the
aspirations of the terror outfit JKLF that has splintered into numerous factions
each pursuing its own agenda? Or is it the aspirations of United Jihad Council
Chief who directs jihad in Kashmir from Pakistan  & who unabashedly puts a condition on the return of the aboriginal
Kashmiri Hindu Pandits back to their hearths & homes in the land of their
ancestors? Or is it the aspirations of double speak Muftis or Abdullahas? You
need to know that most of these perfidious separatists have at one time or the
other been in the so called main stream politics & swore by Indian constitution
when it suited them. 

 

What about the aspirations of
a vast number of Sunni Muslims who do not subscribe to wahabi extremist
thought; or Shias; or Gujjars & Bakarwals; or Kashmiri Hindu Pandits; or
Buddhists & Muslims of Ladakh; or Muslims & Hindus of Jammu? Did you
ever hear even whispers of secession from Jammu or Ladakh? Kashmiri Muslim separatists at the behest
of their masters abroad tried their best to spread their tentacles in Jammu
& Ladakh but failed.

 

And what aspirations are you
talking about? It is a shame that the self appointed liberal mindset does not
react to the brazenness with which a condition to join anti India Jihad in Kashmir
is put on the Kashmiri Hindu Pandits’ return to their homeland. Don’t forget
Kashmiri Hindu Pandits were subjected to ethnic cleansing in the valley because
they professed a different faith & that they were seen symbolising Indian
presence in the valley. And you have the audacity to describe these aspirations
as democratic. There must be something wrong dear. Please clear your
perceptions.

 

Aspirations of Kashmiri
masses are no different from those in rest of India & these could be best judged only in the absence
of the fear of the foreign sponsored ‘gun’ & religious ‘black mail’. Pan
Islamic extremism has only brought miseries to common Kashmiri masses & it
is sad that you side with the
sponsors.

 

When talking about past experiences,
remember no one spoke about wasting of tax payer’s money in crushing terrorism
in Punjab-Khalistanis shed no less blood. And look, today Punjab & Punjabis flourish.


Last but not the least how
else would you like to describe the movement for ‘azdi- bara- e- Islam (freedom
through Islam) that draws inspiration from the likes of terror master minds
like Hafiz Asad & Maulana Massod Azhar? Kashmiri separatist movement is an intrinsic  part of the pan
Islamic terrorism that emanates from Af-Pak threatening the whole world today.
Rgds all

LA

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2010 17:52:35 +0530
Subject: Re: [Reader-list] "A Hindu army officer and an Indian patriot..."
From: c.anupam at gmail.com
To: lalitambardar at hotmail.com; reader-list at sarai.net

Better sense is what if I may ask you sir? Is better sense better than hundreds of thousands of people killed every year, a bloodied battleground in the most inhospitable part of the world sucking away tax payer's money everyday for its maintenance? 


Second, I am not from the generation which saw all these historical blunders being committed by a bunch of leaders. But what I see here everyday is an outcome of such ugly decisions where national ego precedes peoples' aspiration, leading to a bloodied conflict. Is it all worth it? Say i denounce this fractured history and start believing what i am seeing everyday -- which is the case with most of the Indians now. 


The plight of the Kashmiri Pandits is something which needs to be addressed. But everytime, by labeling this identitarian and very localised conflict to a "pan Islamism driven
secessionist terror", arent we siding with the extremists which were waiting to make an issue out of it through numerous bombs? Somehow from these kind of arguments, i feel there is no difference between the extremist thought and action and those who are opposing it. 


The question of national integrity cannot be higher than its subjects' that is peoples' aspirations. It has been realised by various eruptions that have taken place in the country in various forms. But India has a softer side as well, which is of mitigation and diplomacy, which people remember more than the partition or wars it has fought. It is not correct on your part to make such sweeping statements on part of the people always pushing unity and integration into witness boxes. unity and integration of a nation not something forced, just like respect for a teacher or an elder is not something that is to be forced. 




On Sat, Apr 24, 2010 at 5:03 PM, Lalit Ambardar <lalitambardar at hotmail.com> wrote:








Any
compromise aimed at dilution of Indian sovereignty in Kashmir will only endorse M A Jinah’s ‘two
nation theory’ that lead to the partition of the subcontinent & will be
seen as India’s surrender to the pan Islamism driven
secessionist terror. 

 


Let us
not forget the bloody aftermath of the partition. Scars of partition are yet to
heal & those proposing another 'partition' to appease the perfidious Kashmiri
Muslim separatists can not afford to overlook the possibility of jeopardising
the fragile inter communal situation in the country. 

India can not afford to revisit 1947.

Let
better sense prevail.

Rgds all 


LA
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------





> Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2010 16:59:33 +0530
> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] "A Hindu army officer and an Indian patriot..."
> From: pawan.durani at gmail.com

> To: c.anupam at gmail.com
> CC: lalitambardar at hotmail.com; reader-list at sarai.net

> 
> No one in India , not even the Prime Minister of India , has an
> authority to make a decision on Kashmir which may be contrary to the
> resolution passed in Indian parliament.

> 
> This should be kept in mind , leaving apart what politicians do for
> public consumption.
> 
> Pawan
> 
> On Sat, Apr 24, 2010 at 10:42 AM, anupam chakravartty
> <c.anupam at gmail.com> wrote:

> > http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Kashmir-pact-was-just-a-signature-away/articleshow/5850851.cms

> >
> > Excerpts:
> >
> > "He (Khurshid Mahmud Kasuri, who was Pervez Musharraf’s foreign minister
> > from 2002 to 2007) said the two sides had agreed to full demilitarisation of

> > both Jammu & Kashmir as well as Pakistan-occupied Kashmir, which Islamabad
> > refers to as Azad Kashmir. In addition, a package of loose autonomy that
> > stopped short of the ‘azadi’ and self-governance aspirations, had been

> > agreed on and was to be introduced on both sides of the disputed frontier.
> > "We agreed on a point between complete independence and autonomy," he said.
> >
> >
> >

> >
> > On Fri, Apr 23, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Lalit Ambardar
> > <lalitambardar at hotmail.com>wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> A poorly attempted juxtaposition of random thoughts with a mischievous

> >> intent to justify the equally malicious title.
> >>
> >> It is no revelation that foreign jihadists are fighting along with the
> >> local proponents of Azadi- bara – e-Islam (freedom through Islam) in

> >> Kashmir.
> >>
> >> ………‘If violence has declined at present, this is not because India is
> >>  doing the right thing. The militants turned their attention to Kashmir
> >>  in 1989, when the Russians withdrew from Afghanistan. Today, the

> >>  militants have more urgent priorities, again in Afghanistan and the
> >>  Pakistan border. Because the Indian state failed to grant autonomy to
> >>  Kashmir,……
> >>  …..now the pressure has lessened on Kashmir by the removal of militants

> >>  to other parts of Asia……..
> >>
> >> Ayaz Amir also admitted though for different reason (to justify strong
> >> action by Pakistani army against the pan Islamists in Af-Pak region) in his

> >> article ‘A Make-or- break Moment’ Khalij Times/Oct 23, 2009-
> >>
> >> …….. The stakes being so high, there is no choice but to win, and win
> >> decisively. Of course it is not going to be easy. South Waziristan’s

> >> fighters, including the foreign elements, are amongst the most
> >> battle-hardened on the planet. They have been fighting for decades—in
> >> Afghanistan, disputed Kashmir, now FATA…..

> >> ……….3-5,000 Hezbollah fighters defeated the Israeli army in Lebanon in
> >> 2006. At the height of the Kashmir uprising (starting from 1989) there could
> >> not have been more than 5-10,000 guerrilla fighters in the Valley. But they

> >> tied down close to half a million Indian troops, the bulk of which remain in
> >> Kashmir……
> >> (full article at Click here to read the article )
> >>
> >>

> >> Regards all
> >> LA
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >> > Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2010 11:52:55 +0530

> >> > From: waliarifi3 at gmail.com
> >> > To: reader-list at sarai.net
> >> > Subject: [Reader-list] "A Hindu army officer and an Indian patriot..."

> >> >
> >> > http://www.newint.org/features/special/2010/04/01/kashmir-conflict/
> >> >

> >> > A soldier’s story
> >> >
> >> > In the crossfire of daily violence between militants and state forces,
> >> > the picturesque northern Indian state of Kashmir has known no peace

> >> > for decades. In this revealing first-person account, Gopal Mitra, a
> >> > former Indian army Major, offers hard-won insights into how the
> >> > violence could be ended. He spoke to Jeremy Seabrook.

> >> >
> >> > ----------------
> >> >
> >> > Major Gopal Mitra had realized that India’s militarization of Kashmir
> >> > was no long-term solution before he was blown up in Kupwara in 2000.

> >> > An informer had guided his unit to a booby-trapped militant hide-out.
> >> > During the ensuing gun-battle, 17 kilos of RDX explosive went up.
> >> > Airlifted to hospital in Srinagar, Gopal needed 150 stitches to his

> >> > face and body. He lost his eyes and had to undergo facial
> >> > reconstruction.
> >> >
> >> > In and out of hospital for two years, he had time to reflect, both on

> >> > his injuries and what he was doing in Kashmir. Now in his late
> >> > thirties, he is without rancour or bitterness. He works for an
> >> > international disability charity, and says the loss of his eyes has

> >> > been compensated by the insights gained.
> >> >
> >> > ‘As a soldier, you have to believe that terrorism is bad for your
> >> > country. But when you see it close up, you realize there is a reason

> >> > for resistance – usually a result of some earlier failing by the
> >> > State. When violence starts – in the North East or in Kashmir – it
> >> > begins as a way of redressing grievances. But over time, the just

> >> > objective is overtaken, and conflict soon generates its own reasons
> >> > for continuing. When public opinion is met by oppression, there is
> >> > bound to be violence. In Kashmir, when the State installs puppet

> >> > governments with no mandate to act on behalf of the people, how can
> >> > they accept it?
> >> >
> >> > ‘Kashmir is seen as a bilateral issue between India and Pakistan, a

> >> > cause for international concern. This doesn’t address the issue of how
> >> > conflict is sustained on the ground. The whole society is drawn into
> >> > prolonging war. The search for justice is overwhelmed by other

> >> > priorities, including the self-interest of those who gain some
> >> > advantage from it. There are four parties to the conflict – militants,
> >> > civil administration, army and local population. All operate and live

> >> > in the area. The best houses in any village, although far beyond their
> >> > legitimate means, are always occupied by Government officials. Social
> >> > structures, accountability, civil administration have all broken down.

> >> > Transparency International says that after Bihar, Kashmir is the most
> >> > corrupt state in India. It receives huge funds from central
> >> > government.
> >> >

> >> > ‘The whole economy is distorted because basic social norms have
> >> > collapsed. Most stolen cars in India are traded in Kashmir.
> >> >
> >> > ‘Many militants believe passionately in their cause and take up arms.

> >> > This also creates commercial pressures: arms-suppliers who have an
> >> > interest in continuing conflict. After the snowmelt in April-May till
> >> > November, militants cross the passes. They get high rates and bonuses

> >> > for killing members of the security forces. The security forces have
> >> > all the militants’ radio-intercepts: it is known they inflate the
> >> > numbers killed when reporting to their bosses, because this increases

> >> > their bonuses.
> >> >
> >> > ‘There is no adequate rehabilitation package for militants. There is
> >> > no thought-out strategy to absorb them back into society.

> >> >
> >> > ‘It is in the nature of prolonged armed operations to alienate people,
> >> > no matter how disciplined the army. You search houses, knock on doors
> >> > in the middle of the night; people are under siege. Some find serving

> >> > as informers to the army a viable way of making a living. This is how
> >> > the neutrality of civilians is compromised, both by the army and the
> >> > militants. It polarizes people. The army has an incentive to

> >> > perpetuate the crisis, because this vindicates its reason for
> >> > existence and ensures resources are allocated to the area.
> >> >
> >> > ‘I love my country, but that doesn’t mean I don’t think it can become

> >> > a better place’
> >> >
> >> > ‘The initial objectives take second place to conflict for its own
> >> > sake. The idea that an Indo-Pak solution is the only answer places it

> >> > in a different sphere from the violence on the ground. Simple
> >> > one-dimensional solutions don’t work. Societies, easy to divide, are
> >> > harder to re-unite. In Kashmir, if I had a grievance against you, I’d

> >> > have fought it out with you. But now I’ll get two militants to attack
> >> > you. Personal vendettas feed into the wider conflict; private
> >> > animosities get involved, the whole community is distorted.

> >> >
> >> > ‘When you see daily violence, you ask yourself: “Is this what we are
> >> > fighting for?” Before I was injured, I knew armed operations would not
> >> > lead to a solution. But the support system in the army is very robust.

> >> > It helps you not to feel troubled, to concentrate on your duty. The
> >> > camaraderie is strong, and the common danger a consolidating force.
> >> >
> >> > ‘North Kashmir was known as a ‘hot zone’. We were involved in search

> >> > and destroy missions. Militants from Pakistan were servicing bases in
> >> > the forest, stocks of ammunition and guns in camps hidden underground.
> >> > We flushed out and captured arms and personnel. I was leading my

> >> > company when I was injured. I remember only floating in and out of
> >> > consciousness. The speed of evacuation saved my life.
> >> >
> >> > ‘Initially I felt anger and uncertainty. The doctor said: “Look,

> >> > Gopal, I’ll have to take out your eye – if I don’t your brain may
> >> > become infected.” My destiny, which I thought I had taken into my
> >> > hands, took another turn. In hospital I met my wife. Her father had

> >> > also been in the army, and he, too, had been blinded. She was doing a
> >> > Social Work MA and it was through her I came to development work. We
> >> > were married in 2003.

> >> >
> >> > ‘I never hated Kashmir, and afterwards had nothing against the
> >> > militant who deprived me of sight. He was also doing his job. My wife
> >> > and I took our honeymoon in Kashmir. We went as civilians on a

> >> > houseboat. The people we met had no idea I was ex-army. We talked to
> >> > them. They all hated violence. I wanted to remember the beauty of
> >> > Kashmir. Personally, I do not care whether Kashmir is part of India or

> >> > Pakistan. The referendum on Kashmir which never took place after
> >> > Independence [in 1947] can only happen when people are in a position
> >> > to make reasoned choices. Kashmir has been so tainted that such a

> >> > choice is not possible. People need a period of normal life. A
> >> > generation of children have been traumatized; growing in the shadow of
> >> > violence, their childhood play is a mimicry of adult wars.

> >> >
> >> > ‘For any solution, the grievances that hardened into incentives to
> >> > persist in conflict need to be unravelled. After the loss of 80,000
> >> > lives, the Government says: “We have shed blood in Kashmir, and

> >> > therefore nothing can change.” I say: “I lost my blood, but I don’t
> >> > care that much.” Public opinion is manipulated by political parties. I
> >> > can speak with a certain authority, because I actually fought, unlike

> >> > intransigent armchair politicians. If I say India should take a less
> >> > hard line, this is because I have seen the damage hard lines can do.
> >> >
> >> > ‘I love my country, but that doesn’t mean I don’t think it can become

> >> > a better place. If they don’t do things right, thousands more will
> >> > die. Kashmir remains one of the most militarized places on earth. It
> >> > is often said that ethnicity creates violence; but I think violence

> >> > creates ethnicity – people who have lived in amity for centuries are
> >> > moved by injustice, and the divisiveness of that injustice focuses on
> >> > ethnicity or religion.

> >> >
> >> > ‘If violence has declined at present, this is not because India is
> >> > doing the right thing. The militants turned their attention to Kashmir
> >> > in 1989, when the Russians withdrew from Afghanistan. Today, the

> >> > militants have more urgent priorities, again in Afghanistan and the
> >> > Pakistan border. Because the Indian state failed to grant autonomy to
> >> > Kashmir, the social contract between people and State was breached. It

> >> > is easy to explain why the conflict started, but that doesn’t account
> >> > for the way it assumed a life of its own, and its prolongation over so
> >> > many years.
> >> >

> >> > ‘There is no overnight solution. But there is a window of opportunity,
> >> > now the pressure has lessened on Kashmir by the removal of militants
> >> > to other parts of Asia. There is a chance for everyday life to be

> >> > restored, where people will not have their door hammered in at two in
> >> > the morning, or stopped at four roadblocks on the way to the market.
> >> > Indian soldiers will not have instructions during elections to coerce

> >> > 70 per cent of people to vote, just to ‘prove’ they support the
> >> > democratic process.
> >> >
> >> > ‘It is painful to say this as a Hindu army officer and an Indian

> >> > patriot, but truth is truth. I see an opportunity in Kashmir right
> >> > now, especially since Pakistan is troubled by its own internal
> >> > conflict. If we don’t seize it, India will be the loser.’

> >> > _________________________________________
> >> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> >> > Critiques & Collaborations
> >> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with

> >> subscribe in the subject header.
> >> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list

> >> > List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>
> >>
> >> _________________________________________________________________

> >> South Cinema This Decade
> >> http://entertainment.in.msn.com/southcinemathisdecade/
> >> _________________________________________

> >> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> >> Critiques & Collaborations
> >> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with

> >> subscribe in the subject header.
> >> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list
> >> List archive: <https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>

> > _________________________________________
> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> > Critiques & Collaborations
> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with subscribe in the subject header.

> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list
> > List archive: &lt;https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>

 		 	   		  
Catch the changing security environment Get it now.

 		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Catch the latest in the world of fashion
http://lifestyle.in.msn.com/