[Reader-list] Alleged Maoist Atrocities

Tue May 18 22:58:01 IST 2010

Dear Pawan / Rajendra,

The words the two of you use seem to indicate that we should have blind
faith in the 'state'.

Well, I for one do not, as even the 'state' is composed of humans with
follies and vanities as has been exposed in the Gujarat 'terrorist' killing
case as well as the Jessica Lal case where the culprits were first freed.

There are plenty of examples of people running the 'state' going overboard -
even if we ignore extreme examples like Hitler where atrocities have been
done by members of the 'state' against 'people'

Do try and use logic instead of playing with words.

Rgds, Partha

Partha Dasgupta
+919811047132

On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 7:13 PM, Pawan Durani <pawan.durani at gmail.com>wrote:

> Why do you have so much doubt in the state ? Or may I say why do you
> sow so much doubts ? While as you do not do the gardeners job in case
> of separatists, maoists etc..
>
> Pawan
>
>
> On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 6:21 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta
> <shuddha at sarai.net> wrote:
> > Dear Pawan,
> > What motives are you talking about? The only ones that I can see in my
> > posting are a clear and categorical criticism and denunciation of the CPI
> > (Maoist)'s cult of death and a clear, unambiguous criticism with the way
> in
> > which the state is reacting to the situation. Do you see anything else? I
> > don't have to embrace the devil  in order to rescue myself from the deep
> > blue sea.
> > Having said that, I am not blind to the fact that the Indian state (or
> rogue
> > elements from within the state apparatus) have on occasion resorted to
> > elaborate masquerades to create sensational events that bind popular
> > consensus in favour of a hard-line course of action. Remember a place
> called
> > Cchattisinghpura? Remember what happened there just around the time when
> > Bill Clinton came visiting? ast I knew, It was in the province that you
> > claim as your homeland. The questions around Cchatisinghpura still
> remain,
> > and they will not be covered up merely because the state was able to
> extract
> > a 'custodial confession' from an alleged 'detained militant'.
> > What happened routinely in Jammu & Kashmir (especially as authored by the
> > notorious 'Ikhwanis', the Kashmiri equivalent of the Salwa Judum) can
> easily
> > happen elsewhere. This possibility cannot be ruled out, although it must
> not
> > be seen as the only valid explanation either. We need neither blind faith
> in
> > the goodness of the Indian state, nor elaborate conspiracy theories, that
> > indict it in every tragedy.
> > What we need are hard facts. And until the facts are crystal clear, or
> are
> > made clear through explicit assumptions of responsibility by the Maoists
> > themselves of these massacres,or through their implied assent through
> > silence to the fact that they were indeed the perpetrators, it would be
> > premature to jump to conclusions in any direction. You might have
> noticed,
> > that despite my aversion towards Hindutva, I have never, ever made
> capital
> > out of the fact that certain Hindutva activists have been implicated in a
> > series of terrorist incidents. My attitude to any event of this nature,
> is,
> > we must not judge a person to be guilty until he is comprehensively
> proven
> > not to be innocent.
> > If the Maoists remain silent, or own up to their authorship of the last
> > round of violence, (as they did, unhesitatingly, in the case of the
> killing
> > of the 76 CRPF jawans last month) then of course the recent massacres can
> be
> > unambiguously attributed to them. And this must be condemned.
> > If they don't, if they say that they had no hand in what has happened.
> Then
> > it is a different story altogether. It calls for a different kind of
> > response. Not necessarily of endorsing Maoist politics, but of
> recognizing
> > that maybe, they too might be targets of slander.
> > Even in that instance, as I have pointed out, with absolute clarity, the
> > politics of of the Maoists could still be held responsible for creating
> the
> > climate of violence that enables such incidents to occur. And I have no
> > problem in accusing the Maoists of an irresponsible form of politics. it
> is
> > just that I have exactly the same attitude towards the Indian state. I
> will
> > not jump from treetops saying that the state staged a 'false flag'
> > operation. I will not jump from tree- tops saying the Maoists are beasts
> > either. I would look very carefully into the details of a very messy war.
> I
> > am merely asking that all of us undertake a responsibility to being
> > committed to this 'carefulness'.
> > If you saw this morning's post on this list by Aman Sethi of a news story
> on
> > allegations that  adivasis were airlifted, abducted and tortured in the
> name
> > of anti-Naxal operations you would no doubt realize that we are not
> > operating in a situation where there are good guys and bad guys, what we
> > have on the ground are just guys with IEDs and guys with Helicopters.
> > I don't hide behind a fig leaf of a justification of the Maoists when I
> am
> > critical of the state, but I see that for many who are ratcheting up the
> > tempo of paranoia in the name of hunting down anyone who is critical of
> > state action as being automatically a Maoist or at best a Maoist
> > sympathizer, there seems to be no problem at all in hiding behind the
> > obscenity of a war carried out by the state against its own citizenry. I
> > find the double standard of crying yourself hoarse against Maoist
> > sympathizers and remaining silent about the state's mandarins who provide
> > the gloss and the icing over the state's massacres, troubling, to say the
> > least. What compels respectable people to adopt such naked double
> standards?
> > I wonder what their motives might be. I'd be grateful for any answers, if
> > they were available.
> > best,
> > Shuddha
> >
> > On 18-May-10, at 9:12 AM, Pawan Durani wrote:
> >
> > Irony ...... The last para tells all the motives........same people
> > ....same style.....like the Batla house......
> > On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:50 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta
> > <shuddha at sarai.net> wrote:
> >
> > Dear All,
> > While I have on several occasions expressed my disgust at the way in
> > which the Government of India is conducting it's 'Operation Green
> > Hunt', I have to say that the news of the attacks by alleged Maoists
> > in Chattisgarh, in which 6 villagers have been killed, and more
> > recently a bus, with several civilians (and some special police
> > officers)  has been bombed, is deeply disturbing.
> > It is a totally different matter from attacking men in uniform, (such
> > as the CRPF jawans who were attacked not so long ago, resulting in 76
> > casualties). Though I do not support any war, including the Maoist
> > initiated 'Peoples War' or for that matter, the Government of India's
> > 'Operation Green Hunt',  in any war, armed men in uniform in a combat
> > zone are fair targets. The death of the 76 CRPF jawans, though
> > regrettable, is not in any way different from the death of any
> > guerrila soldiers in the PLGA in any combat operation. I refuse to be
> > blackmailed into thinking of such an event as an evidence of Maoist
> > 'atrocities'.
> > But by no stretch of imagination can the same principles of combat be
> > extended in operations that involve unarmed civilians, (such as the
> > incidents that have come to light today) no matter who conducts them.
> > Regardless of whether the state or the Maoists conduct such
> > operations, they must be condemned by all sensible people in the
> > harshest terms. The Maoists, and the state must be compelled, through
> > relentless civic pressure, to publicly abide by the Geneva
> > Conventions in the matter on the treatment of non-combatants in a
> > conflict situation. (And yes, there are conventions that shape the
> > conduct of non-state actors, or the conduct of the state in relation
> > to non-state actors)
> > The presence of 15 special police officers in the bus that was bombed
> > cannot be offered as a justification for the bombing, because a large
> > number of people who were harmed in the attack had nothing to do with
> > any arm of the state, they were just ordinary passengers. This is a
> > simple and disgusting act of terrorism. It cannot be explained away
> > in any sense as part of a campaign of liberation.
> > If it is true that these attacks have been carried out by the
> > Maoists, then, it is clear that they want to ratchet up the general
> > intensity of violence in the regions where they have a presence. They
> > want the government to unleash a military style offensive, because
> > nothing would serve their purpose better. There can be no other
> > explanation for the manner of these attacks. This is a disastrous and
> > cynical policy, which will wreck havoc with the lives of the people
> > of the area and cannot be justified by any means whatsoever. If the
> > government of India responds by increasing the level and intensity of
> > the conflict, it will become an accessory of the Maoists design to
> > totally militarize the areas of central, southern and eastern India
> > where they currently have a presence.
> > If nothing else, this shows how the policy of 'Protracted People's
> > War' is bound to degenerate (and in fact is already degenerating)
> > into an orgy of random violence, exactly as it did in Peru and
> > Colombia, where the 'Sendero Luminoso' ('Shining Path') and 'FARC'
> > rebels competed with the state and right-wing militias in a sad
> > spiralling descent into armed chaos and brigandage that did nothing
> > to fulfil any revolutionary goal. If anything it strengthened the
> > might of the state and the right wing militias in Peru and Colombia.
> > The Maoists actions (attacks on unarmed civilians) cannot bring about
> > any other results either. The ultimate and only beneficiary of this
> > process will be the state and the corporations who want total control
> > over the forests of Central India.
> > However, we must not rush to conclusions. If the Maoists disclaim
> > responsibility for these attacks, then we will have to see whether or
> > not such a disclaimer has any objective basis. Independent
> > investigations will have to be carrired out. If, by any means, it is
> > possible that these attacks are 'false flag' operations, conducted by
> > rogue elements of the state machinery, or even endorsed by the state,
> > then the responsibility for the violence will lie squarely on the
> > state. It must, however, be understood by the Maoists (even if they
> > have not perpetrated these massacres) that the style of their
> > politics can and does ennable the state to conduct precisely such
> > 'false flag' operations. If there are any amongst the leadership of
> > the Maoists who are sensitive to the possibilities of forging an
> > alternative radical politics they must begin considering the
> > necessity of abandoning the disastrous method of 'protracted peoples
> > war' and explore ways to an open, transparent, militant and public
> > politics that does not involve the endless cycle of retreats and
> > massacres.
> > Wherever the truth may life, this is a very sad day indeed,
> > best
> > Shuddha
> >
> > Shuddhabrata Sengupta
> > The Sarai Programme at CSDS
> > Raqs Media Collective
> > shuddha at sarai.net
> > www.sarai.net
> > www.raqsmediacollective.net
> >
> > _________________________________________
> > reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> > Critiques & Collaborations
> > To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
> subscribe
> > in the subject header.
> > To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list
> > List archive: &lt;https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>
> >
> > Shuddhabrata Sengupta
> > The Sarai Programme at CSDS
> > Raqs Media Collective
> > shuddha at sarai.net
> > www.sarai.net
> > www.raqsmediacollective.net
> >
> >
> _________________________________________
> reader-list: an open discussion list on media and the city.
> Critiques & Collaborations
> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
> subscribe in the subject header.
> To unsubscribe: https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/reader-list
> List archive: &lt;https://mail.sarai.net/pipermail/reader-list/>
>