[Reader-list] Alleged Maoist Atrocities

[A.K. Malik]

Hi Mr Dasgupta,
               You can't doubt each and everything happening in/by the the "state" otherwise it would be difficult to survive in the already stressful life.
In lighter vein-Men secretly going in for DNA tests to check paternity of their new born kids.Where the hell are we going to stop doubting?
Regards,

(A.K.MALIK)


--- On Tue, 5/18/10, Partha Dasgupta <parthaekka at gmail.com> wrote:

> From: Partha Dasgupta <parthaekka at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] Alleged Maoist Atrocities
> To: "Pawan Durani" <pawan.durani at gmail.com>, "Rajendra Bhat Uppinangadi" <rajen786uppinangady at gmail.com>
> Cc: "sarai list" <reader-list at sarai.net>
> Date: Tuesday, May 18, 2010, 10:58 PM
> Dear Pawan / Rajendra,
> 
> The words the two of you use seem to indicate that we
> should have blind
> faith in the 'state'.
> 
> Well, I for one do not, as even the 'state' is composed of
> humans with
> follies and vanities as has been exposed in the Gujarat
> 'terrorist' killing
> case as well as the Jessica Lal case where the culprits
> were first freed.
> 
> There are plenty of examples of people running the 'state'
> going overboard -
> even if we ignore extreme examples like Hitler where
> atrocities have been
> done by members of the 'state' against 'people'
> 
> Do try and use logic instead of playing with words.
> 
> Rgds, Partha
> 
> 
> Partha Dasgupta
> +919811047132
> 
> 
> On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 7:13 PM, Pawan Durani <pawan.durani at gmail.com>wrote:
> 
> > Why do you have so much doubt in the state ? Or may I
> say why do you
> > sow so much doubts ? While as you do not do the
> gardeners job in case
> > of separatists, maoists etc..
> >
> > Pawan
> >
> >
> > On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 6:21 PM, Shuddhabrata
> Sengupta
> > <shuddha at sarai.net>
> wrote:
> > > Dear Pawan,
> > > What motives are you talking about? The only ones
> that I can see in my
> > > posting are a clear and categorical criticism and
> denunciation of the CPI
> > > (Maoist)'s cult of death and a clear, unambiguous
> criticism with the way
> > in
> > > which the state is reacting to the situation. Do
> you see anything else? I
> > > don't have to embrace the devil  in order to
> rescue myself from the deep
> > > blue sea.
> > > Having said that, I am not blind to the fact that
> the Indian state (or
> > rogue
> > > elements from within the state apparatus) have on
> occasion resorted to
> > > elaborate masquerades to create sensational
> events that bind popular
> > > consensus in favour of a hard-line course of
> action. Remember a place
> > called
> > > Cchattisinghpura? Remember what happened there
> just around the time when
> > > Bill Clinton came visiting? ast I knew, It was in
> the province that you
> > > claim as your homeland. The questions around
> Cchatisinghpura still
> > remain,
> > > and they will not be covered up merely because
> the state was able to
> > extract
> > > a 'custodial confession' from an alleged
> 'detained militant'.
> > > What happened routinely in Jammu & Kashmir
> (especially as authored by the
> > > notorious 'Ikhwanis', the Kashmiri equivalent of
> the Salwa Judum) can
> > easily
> > > happen elsewhere. This possibility cannot be
> ruled out, although it must
> > not
> > > be seen as the only valid explanation either. We
> need neither blind faith
> > in
> > > the goodness of the Indian state, nor elaborate
> conspiracy theories, that
> > > indict it in every tragedy.
> > > What we need are hard facts. And until the facts
> are crystal clear, or
> > are
> > > made clear through explicit assumptions of
> responsibility by the Maoists
> > > themselves of these massacres,or through their
> implied assent through
> > > silence to the fact that they were indeed the
> perpetrators, it would be
> > > premature to jump to conclusions in any
> direction. You might have
> > noticed,
> > > that despite my aversion towards Hindutva, I have
> never, ever made
> > capital
> > > out of the fact that certain Hindutva activists
> have been implicated in a
> > > series of terrorist incidents. My attitude to any
> event of this nature,
> > is,
> > > we must not judge a person to be guilty until he
> is comprehensively
> > proven
> > > not to be innocent.
> > > If the Maoists remain silent, or own up to their
> authorship of the last
> > > round of violence, (as they did, unhesitatingly,
> in the case of the
> > killing
> > > of the 76 CRPF jawans last month) then of course
> the recent massacres can
> > be
> > > unambiguously attributed to them. And this must
> be condemned.
> > > If they don't, if they say that they had no hand
> in what has happened.
> > Then
> > > it is a different story altogether. It calls for
> a different kind of
> > > response. Not necessarily of endorsing Maoist
> politics, but of
> > recognizing
> > > that maybe, they too might be targets of
> slander.
> > > Even in that instance, as I have pointed out,
> with absolute clarity, the
> > > politics of of the Maoists could still be held
> responsible for creating
> > the
> > > climate of violence that enables such incidents
> to occur. And I have no
> > > problem in accusing the Maoists of an
> irresponsible form of politics. it
> > is
> > > just that I have exactly the same attitude
> towards the Indian state. I
> > will
> > > not jump from treetops saying that the state
> staged a 'false flag'
> > > operation. I will not jump from tree- tops saying
> the Maoists are beasts
> > > either. I would look very carefully into the
> details of a very messy war.
> > I
> > > am merely asking that all of us undertake a
> responsibility to being
> > > committed to this 'carefulness'.
> > > If you saw this morning's post on this list by
> Aman Sethi of a news story
> > on
> > > allegations that  adivasis were airlifted,
> abducted and tortured in the
> > name
> > > of anti-Naxal operations you would no doubt
> realize that we are not
> > > operating in a situation where there are good
> guys and bad guys, what we
> > > have on the ground are just guys with IEDs and
> guys with Helicopters.
> > > I don't hide behind a fig leaf of a justification
> of the Maoists when I
> > am
> > > critical of the state, but I see that for many
> who are ratcheting up the
> > > tempo of paranoia in the name of hunting down
> anyone who is critical of
> > > state action as being automatically a Maoist or
> at best a Maoist
> > > sympathizer, there seems to be no problem at all
> in hiding behind the
> > > obscenity of a war carried out by the state
> against its own citizenry. I
> > > find the double standard of crying yourself
> hoarse against Maoist
> > > sympathizers and remaining silent about the
> state's mandarins who provide
> > > the gloss and the icing over the state's
> massacres, troubling, to say the
> > > least. What compels respectable people to adopt
> such naked double
> > standards?
> > > I wonder what their motives might be. I'd be
> grateful for any answers, if
> > > they were available.
> > > best,
> > > Shuddha
> > >
> > > On 18-May-10, at 9:12 AM, Pawan Durani wrote:
> > >
> > > Irony ...... The last para tells all the
> motives........same people
> > > ....same style.....like the Batla house......
> > > On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:50 PM, Shuddhabrata
> Sengupta
> > > <shuddha at sarai.net>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear All,
> > > While I have on several occasions expressed my
> disgust at the way in
> > > which the Government of India is conducting it's
> 'Operation Green
> > > Hunt', I have to say that the news of the attacks
> by alleged Maoists
> > > in Chattisgarh, in which 6 villagers have been
> killed, and more
> > > recently a bus, with several civilians (and some
> special police
> > > officers)  has been bombed, is deeply
> disturbing.
> > > It is a totally different matter from attacking
> men in uniform, (such
> > > as the CRPF jawans who were attacked not so long
> ago, resulting in 76
> > > casualties). Though I do not support any war,
> including the Maoist
> > > initiated 'Peoples War' or for that matter, the
> Government of India's
> > > 'Operation Green Hunt',  in any war, armed
> men in uniform in a combat
> > > zone are fair targets. The death of the 76 CRPF
> jawans, though
> > > regrettable, is not in any way different from the
> death of any
> > > guerrila soldiers in the PLGA in any combat
> operation. I refuse to be
> > > blackmailed into thinking of such an event as an
> evidence of Maoist
> > > 'atrocities'.
> > > But by no stretch of imagination can the same
> principles of combat be
> > > extended in operations that involve unarmed
> civilians, (such as the
> > > incidents that have come to light today) no
> matter who conducts them.
> > > Regardless of whether the state or the Maoists
> conduct such
> > > operations, they must be condemned by all
> sensible people in the
> > > harshest terms. The Maoists, and the state must
> be compelled, through
> > > relentless civic pressure, to publicly abide by
> the Geneva
> > > Conventions in the matter on the treatment of
> non-combatants in a
> > > conflict situation. (And yes, there are
> conventions that shape the
> > > conduct of non-state actors, or the conduct of
> the state in relation
> > > to non-state actors)
> > > The presence of 15 special police officers in the
> bus that was bombed
> > > cannot be offered as a justification for the
> bombing, because a large
> > > number of people who were harmed in the attack
> had nothing to do with
> > > any arm of the state, they were just ordinary
> passengers. This is a
> > > simple and disgusting act of terrorism. It cannot
> be explained away
> > > in any sense as part of a campaign of
> liberation.
> > > If it is true that these attacks have been
> carried out by the
> > > Maoists, then, it is clear that they want to
> ratchet up the general
> > > intensity of violence in the regions where they
> have a presence. They
> > > want the government to unleash a military style
> offensive, because
> > > nothing would serve their purpose better. There
> can be no other
> > > explanation for the manner of these attacks. This
> is a disastrous and
> > > cynical policy, which will wreck havoc with the
> lives of the people
> > > of the area and cannot be justified by any means
> whatsoever. If the
> > > government of India responds by increasing the
> level and intensity of
> > > the conflict, it will become an accessory of the
> Maoists design to
> > > totally militarize the areas of central, southern
> and eastern India
> > > where they currently have a presence.
> > > If nothing else, this shows how the policy of
> 'Protracted People's
> > > War' is bound to degenerate (and in fact is
> already degenerating)
> > > into an orgy of random violence, exactly as it
> did in Peru and
> > > Colombia, where the 'Sendero Luminoso' ('Shining
> Path') and 'FARC'
> > > rebels competed with the state and right-wing
> militias in a sad
> > > spiralling descent into armed chaos and
> brigandage that did nothing
> > > to fulfil any revolutionary goal. If anything it
> strengthened the
> > > might of the state and the right wing militias in
> Peru and Colombia.
> > > The Maoists actions (attacks on unarmed
> civilians) cannot bring about
> > > any other results either. The ultimate and only
> beneficiary of this
> > > process will be the state and the corporations
> who want total control
> > > over the forests of Central India.
> > > However, we must not rush to conclusions. If the
> Maoists disclaim
> > > responsibility for these attacks, then we will
> have to see whether or
> > > not such a disclaimer has any objective basis.
> Independent
> > > investigations will have to be carrired out. If,
> by any means, it is
> > > possible that these attacks are 'false flag'
> operations, conducted by
> > > rogue elements of the state machinery, or even
> endorsed by the state,
> > > then the responsibility for the violence will lie
> squarely on the
> > > state. It must, however, be understood by the
> Maoists (even if they
> > > have not perpetrated these massacres) that the
> style of their
> > > politics can and does ennable the state to
> conduct precisely such
> > > 'false flag' operations. If there are any amongst
> the leadership of
> > > the Maoists who are sensitive to the
> possibilities of forging an
> > > alternative radical politics they must begin
> considering the
> > > necessity of abandoning the disastrous method of
> 'protracted peoples
> > > war' and explore ways to an open, transparent,
> militant and public
> > > politics that does not involve the endless cycle
> of retreats and
> > > massacres.
> > > Wherever the truth may life, this is a very sad
> day indeed,
> > > best
> > > Shuddha
> > >
> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta
> > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS
> > > Raqs Media Collective
> > > shuddha at sarai.net
> > > www.sarai.net
> > > www.raqsmediacollective.net
> > >
> > > _________________________________________
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> > >
> > > Shuddhabrata Sengupta
> > > The Sarai Programme at CSDS
> > > Raqs Media Collective
> > > shuddha at sarai.net
> > > www.sarai.net
> > > www.raqsmediacollective.net
> > >
> > >
> > _________________________________________
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> city.
> > Critiques & Collaborations
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