[Reader-list] The updated list of killings by the firing ofarmedforces

Sat Sep 20 15:21:57 IST 2008

Dear Radhika,

As is well known, insurgents do often wear uniforms - to be precise  
-  the uniforms of the police and the military. This is a kind of  
camouflage, and it is a masquerade that also indirectly benefits the   
police and armed forces 'special units' which, when they conduct  
their own 'operations', often blame the 'collateral damage' on  
insurgents, who appear like them.

Correspondingly, military and police  personnel, especially those in  
'special units', often do not wear uniforms, sport longer hair, and  
beards, and merge into the general population, exactly as insurgents do.

It might interest you all to know that the motto of the formidable  
Vairengte School of Counter Insurgency and Jungle Warfare (CIJWS) in  
Mizoram, which trains crack commandos from armies all over the world  
in counter insurgency operations is - 'fight the guerrilla as a  
guerrilla'.

Insurgency, and counter-insurgency, as I think you are well aware, is  
often a game of mirrors. Sometimes the camouflage is so good that it  
makes the image and its reflection indistinguishable, not only to  
observers, but even to the protagonists themselves.

regards,

Shuddha

On 20-Sep-08, at 3:05 PM, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote:

> Shuddha,
>
>  your post is bordering on something like insane or very  
> intelligent.? Do the terrorists and insurgents have any uniform. ?  
> Do the protesters in Srinagar have any uniform. ? They see the  
> opportunity and become insurgents and perpetrate terror. be it  
> Mufti or mehbooba they are within the society, but do they have any  
> uniform for terrorists. ?
>
>   Regards.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Shuddhabrata Sengupta <shuddha at sarai.net>
> Date: Saturday, September 20, 2008 2:12 pm
> Subject: Re: [Reader-list] The updated list of killings by the  
> firing ofarmedforces
> To: Pawan Durani <pawan.durani at gmail.com>
> Cc: sarai list <reader-list at sarai.net>
>
>> Pawan,
>>
>> I don't treat news of death as reasons for laughter, no matter who
>> dies.
>> The Col. Thomas who died in Kashmir did not die at the hands of
>> the
>> crowds on the streets of Kashmir. He died while on an operation,
>> in
>> combat, exactly as  an insurgent dies in combat, while on an
>> operation. As one armed man taken out by other armed men.
>>
>> See -
>> http://www.hindu.com/2008/08/24/stories/2008082457840100.htm
>>
>> The report says - "Col. Thomas was killed as he led a quick
>> reaction
>> team from 45 Rashtriya Rifles in the dense forests of Macchal
>> sector,
>> near the Line of Control. His team shot down six militants and he
>> was
>> one of the four Indian soldiers who were killed in the battle."
>>
>> I regret all such deaths, whether they be of Col. Jojan Thomas, or
>>
>> Mohan Chand Sharma, or of a named or nameless insurgent, and
>> consider
>> them to be lives wasted in a senseless war. The only way to stop
>> deaths like these is to stop this war. I want this war to end.
>>
>> The two policemen who died in Jammu happened to be lynched by the
>> crowds on the streets of Jammu. They were not killed by militants
>> in
>> dense forests. The mob killed because it had a sense that it could
>>
>> act with impunity. They were not acting in self defence either. In
>>
>> this case, the mob was not retaliating for violence inflicted upon  
>> it.
>>
>> See - http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/
>> Cops_lynched_rail_track_uprooted_in_Jammu/articleshow/3331088.cms
>>
>> The report says - "Mobs in Jammu lynched two cops to death and
>> uprooted a long stretch of the Jammu-Pathankote railway track."
>>
>> One can compare militants with militants and crowds of protestors,
>>
>> with crowds of protestors
>>
>> And when you do, you realize (if you are not wearing the kind of
>> blinkers that make you think of some deaths as more important than
>>
>> others) the important difference that I was trying to point out
>> between two kinds of 'peaceful protestors', and the responses to
>> them
>> by the state in Jammu, and in Kashmir.
>>
>> Try and cultivate a less vicious sense of humour.
>>
>> Shuddha
>>
>>
>> On 20-Sep-08, at 12:03 PM, Pawan Durani wrote:
>>
>>> lol......funniest post ever.
>>> How soon we have forgotten Col. Thomas who was killed in
>> Kashmir.
>>> and then
>>> the statement  People in Kashmir threw stones, like angry crowds do
>>> everywhere in the world.
>>>
>>> lol........
>>>
>>> What an Idea Sirrr Jee.
>>>
>>> Pawan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Sep 20, 2008 at 1:53 AM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta
>>> <shuddha at sarai.net>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear Radhika,
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for your observations on Khurram's posting.
>>>>
>>>> Well, in this case some  "protesters who claim to be peaceful,
>>>> holding sticks, guns and resort to arson and riot" were
>> "garlanded.">> I am referring to the ones in Jammu. You will
>> recall, that not a
>>>> single policeman or soldier or paramilitary personnel were
>> killed in
>>>> Kashmir. But two policemen did die in Jammu, and some truck drivers
>>>> assaulted by the 'peaceful' protestors in Jammu also succmbed, I
>>>> suppose in your opinion, "peacefully"  from their injuries. Gujjar
>>>> huts were burnt in acts of "peaceful" arson. The crowds in Kashmir
>>>> who were fired upon, 50 of whom were killed at the last count, did
>>>> not bear weapons. We all saw the television pictures. They threw
>>>> stones, like angry crowds do everywhere in the world. But they did
>>>> not kill policemen.
>>>>
>>>> The government did not garland these protestors, it clamped
>>>> indefinite curfews and shot at them to kill. One the other hand it
>>>> did garland the protestors on the other side of the Banihal
>> pass. it
>>>> held some leaders under the Public Safety Act, and then released
>>>> them. It counducted 'negotiations' with the leaders of the peaceful
>>>> protests in Jammu and garlanded them with a sham 'accord'. All
>> these>> prove that if you happen to belong to the right place,
>> sport the
>>>> right kind of name, then even if your 'peaceful' protest turns
>>>> occasionally violent, you can still be 'garlanded' as you (in this
>>>> case) rightly point out.
>>>>
>>>> After all, we live in the country whose government called its
>> nuclear>> weapons tests in 1974, 'peaceful implosions'.
>>>>
>>>> In the novel, '1984' George Orwell, whom I have referred to in an
>>>> earlier posting, wrote about how in the language perfected by
>>>> fictional regime that he was decribing, (newspeak) 'PEACE' was
>> 'WAR'.>>
>>>> are you not indulging in a little modest 'newspeak' Radhika,
>> surely,>> you can do better than that?
>>>>
>>>> warm regards
>>>>
>>>> Shuddha
>>>>
>>>> On 18-Sep-08, at 1:46 PM, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote:
>>>> Khurram,
>>>>
>>>>  your post makes me wonder, whether the protesters who claim to be
>>>> peaceful, holding sticks, guns and resort to arson and riot
>> should be
>>>> garlanded. ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>
>> Shuddhabrata Sengupta
>> The Sarai Programme at CSDS
>> Raqs Media Collective
>> shuddha at sarai.net
>> www.sarai.net
>> www.raqsmediacollective.net
>>
>>
>> _________________________________________
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>> Critiques & Collaborations
>> To subscribe: send an email to reader-list-request at sarai.net with
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Shuddhabrata Sengupta
The Sarai Programme at CSDS
Raqs Media Collective
shuddha at sarai.net
www.sarai.net
www.raqsmediacollective.net