[Reader-list] The updated list of killings by the firing of armedforces

[Pawan Durani]

Dear Shuddha,
Do you mean to say that the people who killed Col Thomas do not enjoy the
hospitality and support of the "crowds" of Kashmir ?

Pawan



On Sat, Sep 20, 2008 at 2:10 PM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta <shuddha at sarai.net>wrote:

> Pawan,
>
>
> I don't treat news of death as reasons for laughter, no matter who dies.
>
>
> The Col. Thomas who died in Kashmir did not die at the hands of the crowds
> on the streets of Kashmir. He died while on an operation, in combat, exactly
> as  an insurgent dies in combat, while on an  operation. As one armed man
> taken out by other armed men.
>
>
> See -
>
> http://www.hindu.com/2008/08/24/stories/2008082457840100.htm
>
>
> The report says - "Col. Thomas was killed as he led a quick reaction team
> from 45 Rashtriya Rifles in the dense forests of Macchal sector, near the
> Line of Control. His team shot down six militants and he was one of the four
> Indian soldiers who were killed in the battle."
>
>
> I regret all such deaths, whether they be of Col. Jojan Thomas, or Mohan
> Chand Sharma, or of a named or nameless insurgent, and consider them to be
> lives wasted in a senseless war. The only way to stop deaths like these is
> to stop this war. I want this war to end.
>
>
> The two policemen who died in Jammu happened to be lynched by the crowds on
> the streets of Jammu. They were not killed by militants in dense forests.
> The mob killed because it had a sense that it could act with impunity. They
> were not acting in self defence either. In this case, the mob was not
> retaliating for violence inflicted upon it.
>
>
> See -
> http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/Cops_lynched_rail_track_uprooted_in_Jammu/articleshow/3331088.cms
>
>
> The report says - "Mobs in Jammu lynched two cops to death and uprooted a
> long stretch of the Jammu-Pathankote railway track."
>
>
> One can compare militants with militants and crowds of protestors, with
> crowds of protestors
>
>
> And when you do, you realize (if you are not wearing the kind of  blinkers
> that make you think of some deaths as more important than others) the
> important difference that I was trying to point out between two kinds of
> 'peaceful protestors', and the responses to them by the state in Jammu, and
> in Kashmir.
>
>
> Try and cultivate a less vicious sense of humour.
>
>
> Shuddha
>
>
>
> On 20-Sep-08, at 12:03 PM, Pawan Durani wrote:
>
> lol......funniest post ever.
>
> How soon we have forgotten Col. Thomas who was killed in Kashmir. and then
>
> the statement  People in Kashmir threw stones, like angry crowds do
>
> everywhere in the world.
>
>
> lol........
>
>
> What an Idea Sirrr Jee.
>
>
> Pawan
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 20, 2008 at 1:53 AM, Shuddhabrata Sengupta <shuddha at sarai.net
> >wrote:
>
>
> Dear Radhika,
>
>
> Thank you for your observations on Khurram's posting.
>
>
> Well, in this case some  "protesters who claim to be peaceful,
>
> holding sticks, guns and resort to arson and riot" were "garlanded."
>
> I am referring to the ones in Jammu. You will recall, that not a
>
> single policeman or soldier or paramilitary personnel were killed in
>
> Kashmir. But two policemen did die in Jammu, and some truck drivers
>
> assaulted by the 'peaceful' protestors in Jammu also succmbed, I
>
> suppose in your opinion, "peacefully"  from their injuries. Gujjar
>
> huts were burnt in acts of "peaceful" arson. The crowds in Kashmir
>
> who were fired upon, 50 of whom were killed at the last count, did
>
> not bear weapons. We all saw the television pictures. They threw
>
> stones, like angry crowds do everywhere in the world. But they did
>
> not kill policemen.
>
>
> The government did not garland these protestors, it clamped
>
> indefinite curfews and shot at them to kill. One the other hand it
>
> did garland the protestors on the other side of the Banihal pass. it
>
> held some leaders under the Public Safety Act, and then released
>
> them. It counducted 'negotiations' with the leaders of the peaceful
>
> protests in Jammu and garlanded them with a sham 'accord'. All these
>
> prove that if you happen to belong to the right place, sport the
>
> right kind of name, then even if your 'peaceful' protest turns
>
> occasionally violent, you can still be 'garlanded' as you (in this
>
> case) rightly point out.
>
>
> After all, we live in the country whose government called its nuclear
>
> weapons tests in 1974, 'peaceful implosions'.
>
>
> In the novel, '1984' George Orwell, whom I have referred to in an
>
> earlier posting, wrote about how in the language perfected by
>
> fictional regime that he was decribing, (newspeak) 'PEACE' was 'WAR'.
>
>
> are you not indulging in a little modest 'newspeak' Radhika, surely,
>
> you can do better than that?
>
>
> warm regards
>
>
> Shuddha
>
>
> On 18-Sep-08, at 1:46 PM, radhikarajen at vsnl.net wrote:
>
> Khurram,
>
>
>  your post makes me wonder, whether the protesters who claim to be
>
> peaceful, holding sticks, guns and resort to arson and riot should be
>
> garlanded. ?
>
>
>
>
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>
> Shuddhabrata Sengupta
>
> The Sarai Programme at CSDS
>
> Raqs Media Collective
>
> shuddha at sarai.net
>
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>
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>
>